Ep 72: Passing as Straight

Sarah: Hey, what's up? Hello. Welcome to Sounds Fake But Okay, a podcast where an aro-ace girl, I'm Sarah, that's me...

Kayla: And a demi-straight girl, that's me, Kayla.

Sarah: ... talk about all things to do with love, relationships, sexuality, and pretty much anything else we just don't understand.

Kayla: On today's episode, passing.

Both: Sounds fake but okay.

Sarah: Welcome back to the pod.

Kayla: Oh, I had one, hold up.

Sarah: It's been brought to my attention that apparently every time we say that there are noises outside, no one can ever hear them, so I'd just like to let you know that I hear noises outside and you won't.

Kayla: Hold on, I had something. Hold on.

Sarah: Oh, my God.

Kayla: No, I saw it. It's not an original. It's not-

Sarah: Kayla!

Kayla: No, this is important to me. Mambo No. 5. This is from a tweet I saw that says, "Tip my hat to a little bit of Monica in my life, a little bit of Erica by my side, a little bit of Rita is all I need, a little bit of Tina is what I see, a little bit of Sandra in the sun, a little bit of Mary all night long, a little bit of Jessica, here I am, Mambo No. 5."

Sarah: How did they fit all of that in one tweet?

Kayla: Tweets are long now.

Sarah: I know, weird. All right, what are we talking about this week, Kayla?

Kayla: Well, I'm probably not going to say much of anything, because I don't...

Sarah: I think you'll say things.

Kayla: I'm sure I'll think of something. We're talking about passing?

Sarah: Passing, specifically passing guilt, and how that relates to privilege.

Kayla: So the guilt of passing?

Sarah: Yes.

Kayla: So if you're not familiar with what passing means, passing is you are a sexuality or a gender that is not-

Sarah: Or a race.

Kayla: Or a race that is not "normative," read straight cis White, and so you, from just looking at you, someone would not necessarily assume that you are not straight, cis, or White.

Sarah: Right. So an example, Halsey, the singer, is half Black.

Kayla: Could not tell you.

Sarah: She is White passing.

Kayla: Do we know who Nikita Dragun is?

Sarah: No.

Kayla: She's a trans woman. Extremely passing. Interesting, because we were talking about her in my class, because there was the whole Victoria's Secret thing about how they were like, "We don't want trans women," and then Nikita Dragun posted this video of her in lingerie doing a whole thing, and people were like, "Yes," but I was like, "Would people be as, 'Yes,' if she wasn't so incredibly passing as a woman?"

Sarah: Yeah, maybe not.

Kayla: Anyway.

Sarah: But anyway, passing is a thing, and there's a lot of privilege that comes with passing, because if you can pass as a normative identity, then life is easier, because people will assume that you have that identity, and so for me as a person whose aro-ace, although apparently I dress gay,

Kayla: You do dress as a gay.

Sarah: But straight people don't always catch that.

Kayla: Straight people, they don't always know gay culture.

Sarah: Yes, and so I am very straight-passing as an aro-ace person who doesn't date, and so that gives me a certain set of privileges, and basically, here's the thing that made me think of this. So basically, for me, being queer, it's a pro, not a con, in my life; granted, I'm not saying that being queer should be a con in people's life, because I think being queer is a wonderful thing. However, for me, being has more of a net positive than a net negative, and that is in large part because of the fact that I am passing, and so I don't need to out myself unless I feel comfortable doing it.

So as a person who is straight-passing, who is White, who is upper-middle class, who's American, I have a lot of privileges that come along with that, and then the fact that I'm able to pass as straight helps me in that, and so it makes me feel guilty about it, because as we've discussed on this podcast before, obviously, how much oppression one has faced should not be a barrier to entry for the queer community, but sometimes I just feel like I'm cheating the system, as a queer person who doesn't really face too much hardship, I'm like, "Ah," and in the wrong situation, my ace-ness is a danger to me, and so is being a woman, but I'm privileged enough that as a White ace woman, I can usually avoid those situations where I would be threatened by those identities.

And in a lot of cases, it kind of sets me apart in a positive way, because I've heard it said that right now is the best time to be a woman in Hollywood, because on one hand, it's bad to say that, but also it's true, and it is a good thing. As a woman, I'm more likely than ever to be hired, as a queer woman, I'm the diversity that people are looking for, and so that benefits me more than it harms me, but because I'm passing, if I'm in a situation where I think it might harm me, my ace-ness, I can pass, and so those are marginalized communities, but given the way of the industry that I'm going into and given the types of people who I want to work for, and marginal identities are actually helping me, and then I feel like there's a certain amount of guilt that comes with that, because since I'm straight-passing, I feel like I can often use my marginalized identities when it's convenient for me, and then when it's not, I can pass as straight, and that makes me feel shitty.

Kayla: Here's my two cents on this.

Sarah: Give me your two cents.

Kayla: I can see all of that. I don't think I necessarily experience any of that because I am straight, and my affiliation, and how I identify with the queer community, and even the ace community, is rocky at best. So I don't really identify with that, but what I will say is, A, you're recognizing that this is a thing. When I was saying last week in Hot Takes that White gays are too powerful, who I was talking about was the white gays that don't realize that they are the White gays.

Sarah: Or they don't care.

Kayla: Or they don't care. You at least recognize that you have this amount of power.

Sarah: And I know that my privilege protects me, so I should use that.

Kayla: Right, and so the best way I can think of for relieving that guilt is thinking about, a lot of times, people that can't pass have to spend so much of their energy and time dealing with being out all the time, and so they might not have the time or energy, be that physical or cognitive energy, to then do other things like activism or helping other people, but for you, since you can avoid some harmful situations, and often, you don't have to spend your energy dealing with other people, that frees you up with time and energy to then do other things like this.

Sarah: Yeah. Well, that's another thing I took some notes on is that I want to use that platform, and because I'm both marginalized as well as privileged, there is a weird tug of war, but some people have no privilege at all, and so they don't have the abilities that I do, and so I want to use that platform. I'm just I'm always afraid I'm not doing enough, but I do have this pod.

Kayla: Yeah, and I mean, I think there's always, "What more can I do?" But I think you also have to think about where you are in your life. We both have a limited amount of money, and resources, and time. We're students; we are not in an area of the world, really, that has a huge impact on anything.

Sarah: But what does that mean?

Kayla: How much can you do from Ann Arbor, Michigan?

Sarah: A lot.

Kayla: But I would argue that there's, perhaps, places in the US that you could probably get more done, and there's more resources than around here.

Sarah: Yeah, but I think it would also take more to get stuff done.

Kayla: Yeah.

Sarah: We have... I don't know, whatever. Continue.

Kayla: So I mean, right now, I think your education and everything is prepping you for what you can do in the future, once you are hopefully working on a TV show. That's more you can do; you just can't do that right now.

Sarah: Right. There was a tweet that I saw that-

Kayla: Congrats.

Sarah: Thank you, that related to this. It's by a TV writer named Javi and his last name, it's Grillo-Mar-something, there's an "X" in it and the "X" throws me off, but his Twitter handle is @OKBJGM. He's wonderful, but so he's Puerto Rican, and he tweeted, he said, "As a White-ish man of privilege, I consider myself as being perpetually on notice. I don't get to do one or several nice things, and call myself an ally or any such thing. Other people can call me that after I'm dead and all the chips are counted. The test never ends." Which I was like, "Yeah, that's true," and so I think if you are a person who has the same sort of privilege I do, or some of the privilege ,or more privilege than me, the test never ends. You got to keep helping people.

Kayla: You can't do one thing, and then... Yeah.

Sarah: Yeah, and that can be difficult, especially if you are not a member of the queer community at all, it can feel very far away.

Kayla: Well, I think it also can feel like you're intruding. It can feel like almost appropriation-ish, or you're overstepping your boundaries, and you don't truly understand what you're getting into.

Sarah: But if you ever feel that way, you can always ask the people in that community what you can do for them that they want you to do. I have one more thing about privilege from Michelle Obama's book, which my microphone is currently sitting on top of. It's from Becoming. It's on page 58 if anyone is wondering, but so she was talking about this high school she went to, and so she said, "But my first month at Whitney Young gave me a glimpse of something that had previously been invisible: the apparatus of privilege and connection, what seemed like a network of half-hidden ladders and guide ropes that lay suspended overhead, ready to connect some, but not all of us, to the sky," and I read that, and I was like, "Oh, shit, some, but not all of us? Michelle is a smart lady," but I was just thinking that, but whoa, whoa, whoa, I was talking too fast. I was thinking about that, because as a person, I have access to those things, not necessarily by virtue of worth work ethic, or merit, or skill, and while those things obviously help me, I have a lot of things because of my privilege, and... Where was I going with this?

Kayla: I just don't know.

Sarah: I don't either. It's fine. I don't know. Point being, we should maybe help try and build more ladders and guide ropes. I got kind of ramble-y in my head, and then those things went on to the notes app, but that's the tea. I don't know what else to say. I know there's a lot more to say, but I just kind of exploded it all at once.

Kayla: I think what this makes me think of is, I have mentioned this before, but I'm in a feminist theory class, and we talked about this feminist concept of living in the tension. This is also something I've talked to my therapist about, but with intersectionality, which is the intersection of people being oppressed not only by gender but also race, sexuality, SES, a lot of things.

Sarah: SES being socioeconomic status.

Kayla: Yeah. There is often a tension between these identities. Today, we were talking about this thing called hiphop feminism, where a lot of Black women were feminists, but also grew up with hiphop, and it had a strong part of their identity, but they realized that part of hiphop culture was misogynistic, and so they didn't want to give up either identity, and so it's kind like of living in this tension of having two opposite parts of yourself. So it kind of reminds me of that, how, as people, at least I know I feel like I want to have one solid identity that's succinct and makes sense to me, but you can't have that, and so for you, it's kind of in between. I'm oppressed sometimes, and I'm privileged sometimes, and you can't just have one; you have to just teeter-totter in the middle.

Sarah: Right, and the goal is to change the world to the extent where the category of oppressed groups doesn't exist anymore, and so that's what you try and use your privilege to achieve, but I mean, I can't see that happening in my lifetime.

Kayla: Probably not.

Sarah: So the ace community, because they tend to face less general oppression from the rest of the world, although that doesn't make them any less queer. I guess this is a very complicated question, but the basic way of stating this question is does the ace community have privilege? And I was thinking about that just now, as I was thinking of it, and I feel like in the broader world, yes, compared to other queer identities, but within the queer community, no.

Kayla: I mean, I think it depends a lot on what people are specifically doing, because I think ace and aro people, there's a lot of very diverse experiences. So people like you who don't date, you're extremely passing. Someone that's ace but homo-romantic, not as passing if they're dating. So I think it really depends on if you're someone that dates, if you're someone that dates who doesn't have sex, if you're someone that has sex, but doesn't date. I think for people like you, yes. If every-

Sarah: That's true, because I don't have the same experience as everyone.

Kayla: If everyone in the ace community had your same experience, I would be like, "Yeah, in the general world," but I don't think that everyone in the ace community has the same level of passing.

Sarah: Yeah, that's true.

Kayla: Maybe everyone that's aro, but aro people can also date.

Sarah: Yeah.

Kayla: So it's like you can...

Sarah: Yeah. I think it's just because ace umbrella identities, they're complicated, and granted, any identity is going to be complicated, but especially within the ace umbrella, there's so much variety and differentiation that as much as we are all under the same umbrella, we're all very different from each other.

Kayla: She's a big umbrella.

Sarah: She's a big umbrella. It's like how the Democratic Party is a big tent, the ace umbrella is a big umbrella.

Kayla: Yeah, and I think the basic assumption if someone is gay is, "All right, you're going to date men. You're going to date men." With ace and aro people-

Sarah: If you're a gay man.

Kayla: Right. There's not, or there shouldn't be, the assumption with ace or aro people, that you have a certain identity, so you are going to do this action, and so maybe we shouldn't have that assumption about gay men.

Sarah: Yeah, we probably shouldn't, but...

Kayla: We probably shouldn't assume, okay, you're a gay man, you're going to date a man.

Sarah: Yeah, but we've said it on this pod before and we'll say it again: humans love to put people in boxes.

Kayla: So the thing with ace people, and because we're within the community, we understand this, is that you can't take an identity and then say that this behavior is going to follow. So it's hard to say for the ace community in general, is there more privilege? I don't know. It depends on how public your actions that go with your identity are.

Sarah: Right. Yeah, that's fair. The more I think about it, the more complicated I realize it is, because I feel like the ace community, for those of us who are passing, we do have a lot of power out in just the real world to help queer communities, and help those people make strides in terms of that thing, but then I was like, but within the community, there's just so much-

Kayla: That's the thing, is there is an amount of privilege, and so you could use that privilege to help the queer community at large, but A-

Sarah: But also, I'd like to use it to help the ace community.

Kayla: Right, but so A, is queer the community at large going to accept your help, and do you feel like a part of that community where you want to give it?

Sarah: Yeah.

Kayla: I think a lot of ace and aro people don't feel comfortable in the greater queer community, and for understandable reasons, so are people even going to want to use their privilege to help a community that's not really serving them?

Sarah: Also, if you help that community, and then that community rejects you, it's-

Kayla: It's like why'd you...?

Sarah: It's like I could have used that effort to help the queer community accept ace people, and it's a difficult thing, and I think there are a lot of different ways to approach it. I think every person you ask will give you a different answer on how to best address that issue. Some people would say you need to integrate with the queer community, some people would say you need to create your own little world. It's confusing. If you're passing, don't feel guilty. Just use your platform.

And here's another thing worth mentioning: for some people, especially... No, just in general, there's no "especially" here, passing is something that they try to do for the purpose of their own safety, and if that is what you're doing, then I would say be thoughtful about how you're using your platform, and if you need to use your passing platform to protect yourself, and to continue to pass because that is the situation you're in, then that's what you need to do, but I think if you are in a position to help other people, then do it. Also, if you're passing, and you feel comfortable coming out, and telling people about, "I am this identity," then by all means, do it, because there might be people watching you who don't realize that you identify with that, and that makes a big difference.

Kayla: I also wonder if maybe part of the reason that a lot of people in the queer community aren't accepting of ace and aro people is because...

Sarah: We're passing sometimes.

Kayla: A good amount of them might be passing. I wonder...

Sarah: Is there a weird jealousy?

Kayla: A jealousy and animosity that... I'm not Black, so I can't speak authentically from this experience, but I've heard Black people say that they have gotten hate from other Black people for talking too White, and so I wonder if it's-

Sarah: Like the whole Oreo thing, Black on the outside, White on the inside?

Kayla: Right, and I can imagine that perhaps there is a similar animosity to Black people who also look White.

Sarah: Who are lighter-skinned, yeah.

Kayla: Right, and so is it a similar thing where people are like, "You're not authentically this identity because you don't look like us, and because you don't look like us, you don't face the same things we do. You're not really Black, because you don't have to deal with the same kind of hate that I do,"?

Sarah: Yeah. I think it all comes back to this idea of there being a barrier for entry, and if you look at specifically Black communities, a lot of the reason why Black people "act White," it's not like that's a real thing, but the way people interpret that is a lot of times because they were raised to do that, and because you can be highly educated and still "talk Black," as some people might say, you can still use African-American vernacular English and be highly educated, but Black people who do talk more White are better respected by White people, and so they're using that to better their lives, and as stupid and horrible as that is, they're just trying to make their lives better, but to some people, it seems like they're distancing themselves from the community.

Kayla: Yeah. There's this thing called respectability politics I also learned in my feminism class.

Sarah: Are you in a feminism class?

Kayla: I am, and respectability politics is this idea that apparently Bill Cosby hardcore endorsed, and I'm like, why didn't we think he was a dumb ass before? This is something that some Black people think, first of all, I think that's whack, but-

Sarah: I don't know what it is yet, so I can't confirm.

Kayla: I think you'll agree with me, is that the reason that Black people are still oppressed is because they're doing it to themselves.

Sarah: I agree with you.

Kayla: To semi-quote something Bill Cosby said, "Pull up your pants, stop talking like that, and maybe you would be doing better in life."

Sarah: The reason that we look down upon that is because we have a culture that has been dominated by White-hood.

Kayla: Right, so the respectability politics says, "Act more White."

Sarah: White-hood, White Ku Klux Klan. Get it?

Kayla: No.

Sarah: You do get it.

Kayla: I do, but stop. The idea is act more White, and you'll get somewhere better in the world. Stop acting like that. Your own actions, your individual actions, are the reason you're having a hard time, not society. It's a completely post-racial argument.

Sarah: Yeah.

Kayla: Post-racial being the idea-

Sarah: Racism's over, yeah.

Kayla: Yeah, which is the same as post-feminism, which is like, "We've done it. It's fine. I'll go lean in and be fine."

Sarah: Yeah.

Kayla: So...

Sarah: Yeah. Yeah, and I think there is some kind of, jumping back to the ace thing, because this is Sounds Fake But Okay, I think there is kind of a weird jealousy, and I understand that jealousy, because that jealousy is based in a place of, "I wish my life were better. I wish this wasn't so hard," but I just think it's misplaced, and that we should be working together, because especially if there are people that have more privilege than you, I mean, you might still be jealous of them, but instead of channeling that jealousy into exclusion and anger, use that jealousy to be like, "I want my life to be better than," not better than yours, but, "better than it is now, more like yours. Can you use your privilege to help better the lives of me and the people around me?"

Kayla: Yeah, and I don't want us to sound like we're coming off like, "You should be jealous of us."

Sarah: Yeah, no, definitely.

Kayla: I think what we're trying to convey is this theory that we are formulating is maybe part of the reason that ace and aro people are rejected, is because of the fact that they get to pass, and other people don't get to experience that, and are, perhaps, resentful, or think, "Well, I can't relate to this person because their experience is so different than mine," when in reality, it's not so different.

Sarah: Well, when people say that we're not oppressed enough so we don't belong in the community, when people say that, a lot of times my gut reaction is to feel guilty about that, is to feel guilty that I haven't been oppressed. A person should never feel guilty that they haven't been oppressed. That's not how the world should be.

Kayla: That's fucked up, yeah.

Sarah: Yeah, it's pretty fucked up, but it's kind of the basis of how I feel, and that's why I think I have so much guilt about, "Am I doing enough? Am I doing enough?" Because I feel like I have to earn my spot in the queer community by doing enough for it, because I'm not oppressed enough to just deserve my spot.

Kayla: Which like-

Sarah: And that's so fucking stupid.

Kayla: And like we've talked about in the past, your oppression should not be what is the-

Sarah: The goal is to try and stop the oppression, not say, "You can only be in this elite club if you've been oppressed X, Y, Z ways."

Kayla: Right. That just almost perpetuates oppression, because it's saying that oppression is necessary to my identity, when it's like, "Why would you want...?"

Sarah: Why would you want that?

Kayla: I understand that logic, but why would you want that to be a defining category in your identity?

Sarah: I don't want oppression to be a defining aspect of the queer community, and that's why I do what I do in trying to whatever extent I am successful, in terms of trying to bring together people in this community, and try to stop the oppression, because I don't want that to be the future of the queer community is just more oppression. Get out of here. No.

Kayla: I mean, you're currently struggling with this. I don't know how qualified you are to give advice.

Sarah: What am I struggling with? Tell me.

Kayla: Your guilt.

Sarah: My guilt, yes.

Kayla: Do you have anything to say to people that may be...? Okay, two people I want you to talk to.

Sarah: Okay.

Kayla: First, talk to the people like you, who may feel guilty for passing. Second, talk to the ace and aro people that don't get to pass.

Sarah: Okay. First, for the people like me who feel guilty for passing, so when I did gymnastics... This is relevant, I promise.

Kayla: I swear. "First, so this one time at gymnastics..."

Sarah: When I did gymnastics, we had this person work with us, her name was Doc Ali, and she also works with the Olympic team, and she works on mental toughness, or whatever, and her name is Alison Reynolds, I think, but one thing that she always said was, "Turn frustration into fuel," and so I think that's something you can do with turn your guilt, this feeling of guilt, into action, in terms of helping this community, so that future members of the community don't have to be oppressed, so that future members of the community won't understand what it feels like to feel guilty about your lack of oppression, because lack of oppression is the norm.

Kayla: Yeah.

Sarah: Yeah, so there's that. What was the other one, people who aren't passing?

Kayla: Yeah.

Sarah: Oh, God, I don't know. First of all, I love you. Second of all, you are deserving of any place in the aspec and queer communities, and if you would like to be a part of those communities, you have a place there, even if some people tell you otherwise. I guess it's not like the goal of every person has to be to pass. I don't think that should be the goal of every person. I think that you should express your identity in whatever way you feel comfortable doing so, and for some people, that means not passing, and some people, it's for financial reasons, or whatever, that they're unable to pass. I don't think passing should be seen as the be all end all, and I don't think everyone should pass, because I think if everyone passed, then we would be sticking with this binary way of the world, and I don't want to stick with that, and so I would say in not passing, you are still kind of enacting a certain kind of positive change, because you're normalizing the act of not passing, and I think that is good.

So I don't know how much advice I can give you, just because I haven't been in that situation. I don't have the authority to speak on that, but I would say whether or not you want to pass, your identity is valid and wonderful, and because I am a person who recognizes my privilege and wants to do something with that, if you think that there's something that the community can do, that people like me can do to help you, by all means, share that information. I can't guarantee that I'll be able to be like, "Yes, I'll do it right now," and just achieve it immediately, but I only know so much, and I only know my own experience, and so sharing your experiences, and sharing what you think can be done to make things better, and then finding those people who have privilege, and who want to use it for good, and teaming up with them is a wonderful thing. Do you have anything to add? Passing, privilege, guilt.

Kayla: I mean, I have a lot of guilt in my life, but that's a personal situation.

Sarah: Oh, my God. The things you say on this pod, Kayla.

Kayla: Listen, I think it's nice that I share my mental health struggles. Other people might relate, Sarah!

Sarah: I just said the things. I was not making a judgment call.

Kayla: For me, this is hard, because I am straight, half of me, I guess, roughly. I don't know.

Sarah: I don't know how that works.

Kayla: And so I pass, because I am, and-

Sarah: I pass, therefore I am. But that's not right. I am therefore, I pass? That's not even true either.

Kayla: Both are bad.

Sarah: Both are wrong.

Kayla: Take those back.

Sarah: I might just have to.

Kayla: And I don't know that I necessarily feel guilt either, and maybe I should.

Sarah: I don't think a person ever should feel guilt unless they've killed someone.

Kayla: That's fair.

Sarah: And they're not guilty, not because you're just a psychopath.

Kayla: That's fair.

Sarah: I don't wish guilt upon anyone.

Kayla: But for me, where I am, I feel like, and this seems like a shitty thing to say, for my capabilities and where I am in life, I feel like I do what I can, and I do enough. Maybe I don't. Maybe I should be doing more.

Sarah: But the fact that you think about that, again, it says a lot about you're aware of it. You're aware of the things.

Kayla: Mm-hmm.

Sarah: Yeah.

Kayla: And also, I have future plans to do more when I know that I'll be able to, I guess.

Sarah: Yeah.

Kayla: So I don't know.

Sarah: Yeah, we're not all Jeff Bezos.

Kayla: Good.

Sarah: Getting blackmail threats from the National Enquirer to leak your nudes.

Kayla: What does that have to do with anything?

Sarah: That's what happened to Jeff Bezos.

Kayla: Yeah, but what does that have to do with what we're talking about?

Sarah: I don't know, he's a billionaire.

Kayla: Oh, my God. Okay.

Sarah: He's the richest man on the planet, and he's getting a divorce.

Kayla: Thank you, Sarah.

Sarah: You're welcome. Back to your regularly scheduled Sounds Fake programming.

Kayla: Jesus Christ.

Sarah: Listen, I think we got too genuine, and I just had to fix it up. What is our poll for this week?

Kayla: I have one.

Sarah: Okay, that's great, because I don't.

Kayla: So this is, straight people, you're out. Anyone that's not ace and/or aro, you're out.

Sarah: That's rude to them.

Kayla: They don't apply.

Sarah: Okay.

Kayla: "As an ace/aro person, ace and/or aro person, do you pass as straight?" I would like to see how many people actually think that they pass this straight.

Sarah: Can we have a secondary poll that's open to all people? Because I think there are a lot of people who deal with issues of passing that aren't members of the ace spec community, and I want to address that. Okay, so we also have a secondary pool. Kayla, hit us with it.

Kayla: Okay, the secondary poll is, "Do you ever feel the need to put in an effort to try to pass?" And then the options are, "Yes," "No," or-

Sarah: Or does not apply.

Kayla: "Does not apply. I am straight, cis and White, so I don't need to pass. I'm already doing it."

Sarah: Right. Yeah, so, "Yes," "No, "Does not apply."

Kayla: Yeah.

Sarah: Cool. What is your beef of the week?

Kayla: Oh, I feel like I just had one. My beef of the week is, listen, so I have curly hair, and so when water gets on it, and it's not the right time, it gets really fuzzy and gross, right? You know what else is water? Snow. You know what it does in the winter? Snow, a lot. So other day, it snowed a ton, and it got all up in my hair then, and so now my hair is gross, and but I didn't even go in the rain, and it's like it shouldn't even be humid, because it's the winter, but here we are.

Sarah: Okay.

Kayla: That's my beef of the week. Also, this headache I've been having for the past week.

Sarah: That's not good. My beef of the week is that I was vacuuming my room yesterday-

Kayla: Can confirm.

Sarah: ... and our vacuum kind of sucks, and it kept just spitting the things that I had just vacuumed back out.

Kayla: It's not a good vacuum.

Sarah: It's not, but you know what? My room is pretty clean right now, and that is my negative beef of the week, meaning my... What's the opposite of beef?

Kayla: Cow, a live cow.

Sarah: My live cow of the week. You can find those polls, both of them, or tell us about your beef, or your live cow of the week, on our Twitter @SoundsFakePod. We also have a Tumblr, SoundsFakePod.tumblr.com. You can email us, SoundsFakePod@gmail.com, or you can visit our website, SoundsFakePod.com.

Kayla: Who is she?

Sarah: Who is she?

Kayla: I finally put up the stickers.

Sarah: Wow!

Kayla: I put up the new sticker of the new logo. Should I put up the green version of our logo?

Sarah: Yeah, sure.

Kayla: Of the sticker?

Sarah: Yeah. Right now, or at least as I'm recording this, we've got some green going on for aro week. I think by the time this is up, it won't be green anymore, but but be aware. So yeah, if you want to get a little green sticker for aro-ness, you can do that. Just hit up our website, and you can find things there. We also have a Patreon, for those of you who would like to support us with your money dollars. Our $2 patrons are... Here's the thing, I don't have it pulled up yet. I'm stalling.

Kayla: God.

Sarah: Remember when I had them memorized? Okay.

Kayla: There's just so many now.

Sarah: There's a lot now, which is wonderful, and I'm very grateful. Our $2 patrons are Keith McBlain, Roxanne Ellis is in Space, Amy and Austin Siegel. Our $5 patrons are Jennifer Smart, Asritha Vinnakota, Austin Le, Drew Finney, and Perry Fierro. Our $10 patrons are Kevin and Tessa, who can be found on Twitter @DirtyUncleKevin, and @Tessa_M_K. Sarah Jones, who can be found on Twitter, Instagram, and Tumblr @EternalLoli. I've been reading that wrong for months.

Kayla: I always read it as Eternal Oli.

Sarah: I read it as Eternal Aioli.

Kayla: Like an aioli that's eternal? Isn't aioli like a food?

Sarah: Yeah, it's like a sauce, like a spread.

Kayla: I always read it as a turn Eternioli.

Sarah: Eternaloli. You can also find my Facebook, Eternal Loli Cosplay. Also, Sarah Jones, I didn't realize that was you.

Kayla: I didn't either. I got that email, and I was like, "Oh."

Sarah: I knew both names, but I never put them together.

Kayla: Wild times.

Sarah: So yeah, Eternal Loli, or Eternal Aioli. I don't know.

Kayla: Your choice.

Sarah: Our anonymous $10 donor, I believe still wants to promote Spring because we're still waiting on it here in Michigan, and elsewhere in the world. Our $15 patron is Nathaniel White. You can find his portfolio online at NathanielJWhiteDesigns.com. Also, if you want to just give us money one time, we have a PayPal, which is just our email address, SoundsFakePod@gmail.com.

Kayla: Or it's on our website.

Sarah: Oh, it is on our website. Thanks for listening. Tune in next Sunday for more of us in your ears.

Kayla: Until then, take good care of your live cows.