Ep 278: The Ick
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SARAH: Hey, what's up? Hello. Welcome to Sounds Fake But Okay, a podcast where an aroace girl, I'm Sarah, that's me
KAYLA: And a bi-demisexual girl, that's me, Kayla
SARAH: Talk about all things to do with love, relationships, sexuality, and pretty much anything else we just don't understand.
KAYLA: On today's episode, the ick.
BOTH: Sounds Fake But Okay.
[Intro Music]
SARAH: Welcome back to the pod
BOTH: Live and in person.
SARAH: Wow. We're looking into each other's eyes.
KAYLA: I'm not used to looking at anyone anymore.
SARAH: Hello.
KAYLA: I know, it's kind of uncomfortable.
SARAH: I don't know what to tell you.
KAYLA: I don't know how I feel about it.
SARAH: I don't know what to tell you.
KAYLA: Okay.
SARAH: Busy week, huh?
KAYLA: Busy week, huh?
SARAH: I wonder why Kayla is in the same place as me.
KAYLA: I wonder. I wonder why my voice is so tired.
SARAH: Yeah. Mine's not.
KAYLA: Yeah. Well, you have other issues, so.
SARAH: Some of us have strong vocal cords.
KAYLA: And weak spit.
SARAH: No, too much spit.
KAYLA: Weak.
SARAH: Clicky noises.
KAYLA: Weak spit.
SARAH: This week we learned my mouth makes too many clicky noises.
KAYLA: I really don't like mouth noises. I don't like hearing people eat. But Sarah and I were attached at the ear for several days this week. And I got...
SARAH: And it was a high-quality mic situation.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Like best quality possible.
KAYLA: Yeah. So, I really got very...
SARAH: She got some ASMR.
KAYLA: I got really familiar with the sounds that Sarah makes. I will... I cannot tell you, Sarah, how much I will kill you. I'm so over your mouth sounds.
SARAH: I'm sorry you hear that.
KAYLA: Okay.
SARAH: But yeah. We were together for several days. Talking into microphones.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: For some reason.
KAYLA: Who's to say?
SARAH: You may have some guesses.
KAYLA: Maybe.
SARAH: We won't confirm or deny at this point.
KAYLA: No.
SARAH: But, you know, that did happen.
KAYLA: Mm-hmm
SARAH: It turns out green apples are really helpful if your mouth makes a lot of clicky noises.
KAYLA: The more you know, I guess.
SARAH: And Kayla likes to add ends into words.
KAYLA: Okay, we don't have to get into this.
SARAH: She kept pronouncing intimate as intimant.
KAYLA: It happened like twice. It didn't keep happening
SARAH: It happened about five times. I let some of them go.
KAYLA: Okay. We're joined by the cat. He is here on the table.
SARAH: Yes, he is. Kayla is here in LA. So, we're recording in my… I was about to say my kitchen, room.
KAYLA: In the room where all of the rooms are.
SARAH: In the room that's not my bedroom.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: So, it's a new little space, so sorry if the audio is a little funky.
KAYLA: Sorry.
SARAH: But we both have our mics and my computer sounds like it's about to take off into space.
KAYLA: So.
SARAH: So. All right. Kayla, any other housekeeping other than mysteries?
KAYLA: Mysteries. Hashtag soon.
SARAH: Hashtag soon. No? Okay.
KAYLA: Okay.
SARAH: Kayla, what are we talking about this week?
KAYLA: This week we are discussing the ick.
SARAH: The ick. Wait, I have a piece of housekeeping.
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: I can't believe so few of our listeners knew what cuffing season was.
KAYLA: Yeah, I mean, I can't say I'm surprised given our audience.
SARAH: I know, but we almost forgot to define it.
KAYLA: It's really good we did. But like did you not hear the song cuffing season?
SARAH: It's cuffing season.
KAYLA: I thought it was everywhere.
SARAH: Apparently, we live in different corners of the internet.
KAYLA: I guess. So yeah, I'm glad I remembered to define it because it seems that many of you did not know what was going on. So, we will make sure to define the ick before we get too far.
SARAH: Let's start right now. What's the ick, Kayla?
KAYLA: Well, okay, here's the thing. Is because I think that there's, I had a conception of the ick going into this and then I did some more research and I got a better idea of what it actually is. But I think it has been conflated over time. So, I think maybe we can start with what we think it is and then we can get to the root of it.
SARAH: Yeah, okay. I would define the ick as if you are seeing someone generally in a romantic slash sexual way. And you're like fairly early in the relationship usually. And they do something that is like really a turn off for you.
KAYLA: Yes
SARAH: Like not just a turn off in that moment but like a turn off to them as a person.
KAYLA: Forever, yeah. Like it ruins the whole thing.
SARAH: It doesn't have to be like a full red flag, but it can just be something that you're like I can't deal with this.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: I feel like something I hear about is people have strong thoughts on whether you should wear socks while you're doing the do.
KAYLA: Yes
SARAH: And I feel like that's a thing that people would ick about.
KAYLA: Yes. I've even heard like oh just seeing a guy wear flip flops is an ick.
SARAH: Is an ick
KAYLA: So, here's my thing. I think you're 100% correct and that's in general what I thought too. But the way I was introduced to the ick was just like seeing people talk about getting the ick for certain reasons. I had never heard the definition really. I had just heard people being like oh this guy did this, now I have the ick. And it always seemed like very trivial things like wearing flip flops or like when I saw and I have some examples that we can go over later but like a guy running after a ping pong ball after it goes loose during pong.
SARAH: Someone has got to do it.
KAYLA: Right but like no one looks good being like scrounging you know. So, it's like things like that. So, I was like it feels very trivial but I think when you get to the root of it, it makes a lot more sense and you can see why this is happening. You see? So I have some TikToks I found of people talking about the ick and I also found an article from Cosmo.
SARAH: Our besties.
KAYLA: Our besties. It's very funny because I was reading some transcripts of old episodes recently and we're like just trashing Cosmo especially their like Snapchat story.
SARAH: I feel like they've come a long way though.
KAYLA: They have and we know someone that like works at Hearst which owns Cosmo and they were like thank you for saying that like we've worked very hard recently to like turn it around and I was like you're doing great.
SARAH: Slay.
KAYLA: Slay.
SARAH: We do?
KAYLA: I love how much you don't know.
SARAH: I don't know anything.
KAYLA: So, this is an article from August of this year 2023 and it's called The Ick: What is the ick and why do we get it? So just getting into… so apparently it was coined by Ally in the TV show Ally McBeal.
SARAH: Oh. So, it's like it's been around a while.
KAYLA: Yeah, I get I only… I feel like I started hearing about it like this year.
SARAH: I started hearing about it in the past I would say like two years.
KAYLA: Yeah, it feels recent. But so this one dating expert Haley Quinn says it's a dating term that means you get a sudden cringe feeling when you have romantic contact with someone and become almost immediately put off by them. So, you might feel like suddenly repulsed, put off, or cringed out and that's the ick feeling. It's different from doubting whether you want to be with somebody. It's more like a repulsion. It's getting a very strong gut reaction either to the mannerisms of the person or the way they behave or it could be like their value system maybe like their politics, maybe the way that they laugh or tell a joke irritates you, the look, the smell like it could go from big things like ideologies to like small things like they have a terrible laugh or something.
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: So, that's like the basic definition which to me makes it feel a lot more legitimate. Like I feel like.
SARAH: Legitiment?
KAYLA: Stop! Legitimate. I'm sorry this is just how I talk.
SARAH: I know but like I've just become more aware of it.
KAYLA: Enough.
SARAH: And I'm going to point it out to you.
KAYLA: I wish you would have. Because what I had seen… and I feel like it's especially women talking about men.
SARAH: Yes, generally. Yeah.
KAYLA: Like I feel like it always seemed like very trivial things and I was like is this really… like what is this really and then I always see like guys complaining about it of like man I can't fucking do anything.
SARAH: Well, I feel like in my mind if someone's like I'm not going to date… like I'm breaking up with them because they're a Republican and they don't think women should have rights. To me that's not an ick. To me that's like a…
KAYLA: That’s a fundamental… yeah
SARAH: That’s a foundational, fundamental difference that you cannot overcome to make this relationship work.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Whereas like he wears flip-flops sometimes to me is an ick.
KAYLA: An ick, yeah. The best way… I'll find the TikTok. Because I was looking up like people basically just explaining like what the ick is. And this one guy I thought explained it really well. And he was basically saying like I hear from a lot of guys that they don't get the ick but like I get it so I'm going to explain it to you. So, this is Montane
SARAH: Okat
KAYLA: @ohmontane. Oh my god he has like 1.5 million followers. Hello.
SARAH: Hell yeah.
KAYLA: So, he's explaining it. So, he's basically saying it's anything that reaches from big to small that someone says or does that makes you feel almost like physically queasy. So, like previously you were thinking all good things about them. You were interested in them. And then it just like makes you feel gross. So, the example he gives is he was talking to someone and on multiple occasions they used the wrong their like T-H-E-I-R when it should be like T-H-E-R-E that kind of thing. And he like got the ick. And I was like okay I feel like I'm starting to understand it now because there are times when I see people doing stuff and I like I cringe. I'm like I'm embarrassed for you. Like we went roller skating this week and there was a couple of people that had like really really bad falls. And I was like uh uh uh.
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SARAH: Yeah, was I one of them?
KAYLA: No, you fell fine but the one lady like she… it looked like she almost cracked her head open.
SARAH: Yeah, they had to like…
KAYLA: It was like a lot with these several ladies like running into each other. But I was like okay I get it because sometimes you see people doing things and you're like uh.
SARAH: I fell in a charming and a graceful way.
KAYLA: Yeah, Sarah was um really charming. Um.
SARAH: Famously.
KAYLA: Famously. Yeah. So, I don't know that made it make more sense to me or a couple people explained it of like just very suddenly losing attraction to someone.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Which I was like okay when you put it in those terms.
SARAH: It’s like spike
KAYLA: Right, it's like spike. I was like when you put it in those terms, I'm like okay I talk enough about sexuality and attraction that I was like okay I get.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: How that could happen. How you're like oh I'm sexually attracted or romantically attracted to this person. And then very suddenly I see them in flip flops and I'm like actually.
SARAH: Actually, I can't do this.
KAYLA: I'm actually good now.
SARAH: And like it sounds so like surface level and petty…
KAYLA: Yes
SARAH: But like that's just like the way humans work.
KAYLA: It is.
SARAH: Like what are you going to do about it?
KAYLA: Well, in this article, the Cosmopolitan article, they talk to a couple like psychologists and like dating experts you know whatever. And they talk about like why people catch the ick and they're basically saying it's your gut reaction, like it's your intuition.
SARAH: Like something is wrong.
KAYLA: Right.
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: So, like you know I think we all probably used to be way more intuitive in the stone age days when like we had…
SARAH: Back when we had stones. When we stone. When we stoned.
KAYLA: When we were stoned.
SARAH: When we were stoners.
KAYLA: You know what I mean? Like we had to be intuitive to survive. And I think humans as a whole have lost a lot of that because we just like don't need it anymore.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: So maybe you can get a gut reaction for something that doesn't actually matter.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: But like on the whole, the idea of the ick is just like your gut instinct being like this person is not it.
SARAH: Yeah, it's the same as you being like you know I always got weird vibes from that person and they never did anything specifically wrong but now that I hear that they're a mass murderer that makes sense.
KAYLA: Yeah. This also says Gurpreet, I think she's like a psychologist in this article, saying that people undervalue the amount of unconscious communication that happens in a relationship. Our responses to somebody's smell, behavior, or value systems can largely be unconscious so it comes for those unconscious gut reactions. So, it's not something that you could necessarily even like put your finger on.
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: You know. Oh, and then the article goes on to give some examples of women like talking about the times they've gotten icks and why. So, this girl Vanessa was talking about how she had been going out with this guy for a couple weeks before they had sex for the first time and then after they had sex she just found him kind of annoying but told herself it was like normal, carried on. And then she said about three months in, something just switched in her head and she couldn't stand him anymore. Like his voice annoyed her, his jokes weren't funny, like she just like clammed up when he tried to like hug her or kiss her and she like didn't get why so she stayed with him for a while even though she didn't like him anymore and then she just was like okay it's over goodbye. Yeah, it's interesting because it doesn't even have to have a reason really you're just like you're really actually fucking annoying.
SARAH: Yeah. I found a BuzzFeed quiz from January 29th, 2022. Let's see if these 21 highly debatable behaviors give you the ick or not.
KAYLA: Mm
SARAH: Okay. They define the ick as a cringy feeling you get when someone you like does something that ruins your attraction to them.
KAYLA: Okay yeah.
SARAH: All right. Does talking about their ex on a first date give you the ick? I've never been on a first date nor have I ever had an ex. For me I think it would depend on the context.
KAYLA: Yeah, I think it… I would say gut reaction it's an ick but there could be situations where it's fine.
SARAH: Okay. I'm going to say yes it gives me the ick.
KAYLA: The ink?
SARAH: And 79% of poll takers agree with you.
KAYLA: Okay
SARAH: 44.9 thousand votes.
KAYLA: Jeez.
SARAH: Two, does using two in one shampoo give you the ick? Yes
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: Only 46% of people agree with you. What men are taking this quiz?
KAYLA: Well that one I also think depends on age because I feel like as you get older you start to like not like… you can't excuse certain things anymore.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Like when I was in college like living in a very dirty environment or like being very cheap I was like yeah whatever. But then the older I get I'm like there's no excuse for us to be living this way anymore.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Like we're adults now.
SARAH: It's like our friend in college who we lived with had like fucking three in one. I don't even know what the third thing was.
KAYLA: A body-wash?
SARAH: I don't know maybe I guess. To which I say sir please.
KAYLA: No.
SARAH: But I wasn't dating him and I continue to not be dating him.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: But to me it's like if you like call them out on it and you're like dude why the fuck…
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Like I think their reaction to that dictates…
KAYLA: Yeah, that’s very telling
SARAH: If they're like… if they're like weirdly defensive about it then I'm like whoa what is this.
KAYLA: Yes
SARAH: If they like laugh it off and continue to use it okay.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: But if they're like why does it matter and then you explain it to them and they're like oh okay.
KAYLA: The greenest flag I see… I feel like I see a woman on TikTok talking about this all the time of just like recommending like little beauty tips to their boyfriend and then their boyfriend gets like super into like skincare and stuff like to me that's the biggest green flag.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: I'm like yes face masks together.
SARAH: Two in one shampoo cannot… it's doing two things poorly.
KAYLA: Also, like can we talk about… this is nothing anymore, men just like don't wash their face they just like wash it with like a bar of soap and then it's like the most clear skin.
SARAH: So unfair.
KAYLA: You've ever seen.
SARAH: It's so fucking unfair
KAYLA: I don't get it. That's my ick.
SARAH: Oh my god. Does refusing to tip give you the ick? Yes.
KAYLA: Yes
SARAH: That's like more than the ick.
KAYLA: Yeah, that's like a fundamental issue.
SARAH: That's like I won't talk to you anymore.
KAYLA: Yeah, that's a problem.
SARAH: I… every couple of months there's discourse on Twitter where some Europeans are like when I go to the US I don't tip because it's a broken system and it's like…
KAYLA: You not tipping is not going to fix that.
SARAH: That's not going to fix the fucking system and I get so mad they're like well employers should just pay their employees and it's like yes you're fucking right but you like shorting this poor 18 year old waiter that they can't fucking pay for their groceries isn't fucking solving that you're not on some fucking high horse high and mighty fucking whatever European shit anyway 80% of people agree with us.
KAYLA: Ick
SARAH: Does clapping when a plane lands give you the ick?
KAYLA: Uh
SARAH: If they initiate the clapping yes.
KAYLA: Yes
SARAH: If they just join in I'm going to say no.
KAYLA: It depends if it's ironic or sincere, I guess.
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: One time my dad started to clap you were on the plane. Do you remember this?
SARAH: Vaguely.
KAYLA: It was tough. That's all.
SARAH: I'm going to say no on this one with caveats. 70% say yes it gives them the ick.
KAYLA: That's fair though. I get it.
SARAH: Yeah. Does talking about having kids on the first date give you the ick?
KAYLA: I think it depends on age to be honest.
SARAH: That's very fair.
KAYLA: I think if you're 21, yes. If you're in your 30s, no.
SARAH: Also, if one of you already has children, that's something you would probably want to discuss early on.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: I'm assuming this is probably talking about younger people though, so do we want to say yes to this?
KAYLA: Yes. I'll say yes.
SARAH: 67% of people agree with you.
KAYLA: Okay
SARAH: Does talking while chewing give you the ick?
KAYLA: Yes. Well, how close am I to them?
SARAH: It depends how egregious it is.
KAYLA: It depends how sloppy it is. Because I talk while I'm chewing.
SARAH: I feel like there's no one who doesn't.
KAYLA: Yeah, I guess I can't say yes.
SARAH: It's just like don't be fucking obnoxious about it.
KAYLA: It's like don't be sloppy and wet about it.
SARAH: Yeah. 80% of people said yes to the ick and I think about 60% of those people are hypocrites.
KAYLA: I get it though, but I don't think people are thinking through it enough.
SARAH: Do dirty fingernails give you the ick?
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: I'm going to say no because what if they're like a landscaper or a gardener?
KAYLA: Here's… can I tell you why…
SARAH: Why
KAYLA: Dirty fingernails are often a concern for hygienic reasons if you're doing sexual things.
SARAH: Well, you make them wash their fucking hands.
KAYLA: I know but some men…
SARAH: Oh my God
KAYLA: Don't, and that's why it's the ick. Because if a man… it is just like, yeah sure if they're working in the dirt, of course. But if you're just like walking around in day-to-day life with dirty fingernails then we have a problem.
SARAH: Yeah, for me if it's like, if you have dirty fingernails I'm going to be like, dude do something about that. And then if they're like, no, then that's a major ick.
KAYLA: Yeah, I don't know I think it's an ick.
SARAH: I'll say yes. 85% percent agree with you.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Does eating in bed and finding crumbs in their sheets give you… Sheets?
KAYLA: Oh, I mean.
SARAH: That's usually how it works.
KAYLA: I mean, yeah.
SARAH: Does eating in bed and finding crumbs in their sheets give you the ick? No. Not unless it's like...
KAYLA: It depends. If it's like the first time you're like going to their place or something then it's like why didn't you clean up for me? But like if it's me and Dean, they're probably my crumbs.
SARAH: I eat in my bed all the fucking time.
KAYLA: They're probably my crumbs.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: But we have to think though a lot of times they're talking about ick in like a new relationship.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: And if it was new I would say yeah, probably.
SARAH: Okay. This webpage just had a fucking aneurysm in it so please hold on.
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KAYLA: Oh
SARAH: Okay, so we're going to say yes on this one.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: 74% of people agree. Yeah, I think it's just… for me I don't have an issue with eating in bed and having crumbs in the sheets. I have an issue with like the carelessness if you're early in a relationship.
KAYLA: Yes, I have an issue with like you knew someone was coming over so you should have like cleaned up.
SARAH: You should have at least brushed the crumbs to the ground.
KAYLA: Right. I'm not saying you have to like completely switch your sheets. Lord knows I don't wash my sheets as much as I should. But like you should put some effort in.
SARAH: Yeah. Does having pasta sauce stains on the corners of their mouth give you the ick?
KAYLA: If it was a first date… because here's the thing, is I feel like I would feel embarrassed for them. Like it would be second hand embarrassment which I think could be the ick.
SARAH: Yeah, that's fair.
KAYLA: I don't know. I don't know about that one. I don't know.
SARAH: Again, it's a situation of like they might not fucking realize it.
KAYLA: Yeah, that's the point is they don't realize it.
SARAH: But like sometimes you don't realize shit. I'm going to say no. I'm going to say no.
KAYLA: Okay
SARAH: Um the web page had another aneurysm.
KAYLA: Hmm.
SARAH: Uh 75% of people said yes. 25% no. Does drinking 2% milk give you the ick? No.
KAYLA: Uh yes.
SARAH: I give you the ick.
KAYLA: Sarah, I've told you about my thoughts on your milk habits.
SARAH: I actually don't drink nearly as much milk as I used to. Like I don't have any in the fridge right now.
KAYLA: Good. Good
SARAH: So. And sometimes it gets bad before I finish it.
KAYLA: Wow
SARAH: And I only buy half… I only buy half gallons.
KAYLA: That's growth. That's growth.
SARAH: Anyway, I'm going to say no to that.
KAYLA: Okay.
SARAH: 76% of people agree with me.
KAYLA: Really?
SARAH: Yes.
KAYLA: That's actually very shocking.
SARAH: I feel like people hate on milk drinkers but like it's not… it's like they do it as kind of as part of a meme. Like if someone actually… like if someone actually drinks milk, they're going to be like ew you drink milk but then they're not going to be like this makes you a bad person. Unless they're like a hardcore vegan.
KAYLA: It depends for me on again the attitude. If I joke with you about like you have to have… if like… if I… okay here's when it could be the ick. I… you go over to a guy's house and he's like oh we're going to cook dinner and then he's like I'm pouring myself a glass of milk I drink milk with dinner every night I must. Then I would be like.
SARAH: Sounds like they got the tism.
KAYLA: Hmm, well yeah maybe but I would be like… and if I like pushed back on it and they were like and I was like but do you drink water and then they were like no only milk then I would be like.
SARAH: I did that for most of my life.
KAYLA: Yeah, I'm not attracted to you.
SARAH: I'm drinking water right now.
KAYLA: Good.
SARAH: I'm so brave.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Okay. Does not texting back for days on end and then saying sorry, just got… just got this give you the ick? If it's habitual.
KAYLA: Yeah, if it happens all the time yes that's it.
SARAH: Also like it seems like they're lying.
KAYLA: Yes, that's definitely lying and also… especially early in a relationship if you're like in the talking stage and then that happens then it's like we're not doing this.
SARAH: You're fucking ghosting me. Bye.
KAYLA: We're not doing this.
SARAH: Yeah. I'll also just like… if you don't text back for days and then you're going to respond just be like… just be like I'm so sorry I didn't get back to you.
KAYLA: That's what I do. I do this often and I'll just be like so sorry I'm a terrible person. I’m back
SARAH: Yeah. Or like I'm so sorry I opened this text and then forgot to answer it and then remembered about it like three days later.
KAYLA: You just have to be honest. You have to fess up.
SARAH: Seventy seven percent of people agree with us. Does love bombing on dating apps give you the ick? And they specify love bombing is overwhelming someone with loving words, actions, and behavior and then totally ignoring them. Well, fucking yeah.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Why would you continue even wanting to see them.
KAYLA: I mean, I think…
SARAH: If they start ignoring you
KAYLA: On dating apps especially like someone coming on way too strong way too fast is definitely an ick
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: Because it's like you don't know me.
SARAH: You don’t know me
KAYLA: You can't be giving me like… like compliments on appearance sure like oh you're funny as you're texting.
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: But like if it gets too far you're like you don't actually know me.
SARAH: I want you to bear my children.
KAYLA: No. That's fucking weird.
SARAH: Anyway, 95% of people agree with us. Does buying one ply toilet paper give you the ick. If you're on a budget…
KAYLA: It depends on what the rest of their house looks like.
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: If you have navy sheets and one pillow and great curtains and a moldy bathtub and one ply toilet paper then I'm like okay….
SARAH: Then your ass is crusty.
KAYLA: Then your ass is crusty.
SARAH: I don’t want you near me
KAYLA: But if you have a put together life and then you're budgeting that's like whatever. Sure.
SARAH: So, are we going to say yes or no?
KAYLA: I don't know. It depends.
SARAH: I'm going to say one ply toilet paper alone. No.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: Okay. 70% said yes 30% no.
KAYLA: Mm
SARAH: I think a lot of this is really contextual.
KAYLA: Well, yeah.
SARAH: Does saying you're different than other girls slash guys give you the ick? Yes.
KAYLA: Yes.
SARAH: I can't believe only 78% of people agree with us. Fucking pick me shit.
KAYLA: Who is being turned on by that?
SARAH: Jesus. Does using a top sheet give you the ick? As someone who is very anti top sheets and doesn't like top sheets at all I would say it doesn't give me the ick because it's common.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Like so many people do it.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: But like if we are going to have a long-term relationship wherein we share a bed we will have to have a conversation about this.
KAYLA: Well, you could just do. Here is what me and Dean do, because I am a blanket stealer. Me and Dean have separate blankets. So, like I will use a top sheet in the summer as like my personal blanket because it gets hot and then we have like our own winter blankets so we don't share. So that your partner could just use the top sheet.
SARAH: Yeah, that's fair.
KAYLA: If they only have a top sheet.
SARAH: That's weird.
KAYLA: Yeah, but… okay picture the navy bed with one pillow. Usually there's just a sheet there. Then that's an ick.
SARAH: And they probably sleep naked too.
KAYLA: Maybe.
SARAH: So, I'm going to say does using a top sheet give you the ick? No.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: But every time my mom is reminded of the fact that I hate top sheets she's like I did something wrong.
KAYLA: A lot of people don't like top sheets though. I feel like that's pretty common.
SARAH: Yeah. 82% of people said no. Which I think is right.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Does saying no to free bread at restaurants give you the ick?
KAYLA: I think it's a bit strange.
SARAH: Yeah. I don't know if it's fully ickable. But especially if you're saying no for both of us and you haven't conferred with me fast, that's a problem.
KAYLA: Yes, that’s an ick
SARAH: Also, they usually don't ask. They usually just bring it to you.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: So, are you just… are they bringing it to you and you're saying no, take it back?
KAYLA: I don't know. I don't think I would get the ick. I would be curious.
SARAH: Yeah. I would be confused. Maybe you're gluten free, but also you don't get to decide for me whether I want to eat this bread or not.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: So, I'm going to say no. Okay, 54% said no. No ick to that. Does eating sushi with a fork give you the ick?
KAYLA: Ooh, maybe.
SARAH: I would say if you... Okay, I don't eat sushi. I couldn't use chopsticks until a couple years ago, at which point I was like, I'm going to teach myself to use chopsticks. And it was not that hard. I think if you're just like, if you have sushi at your fucking house and you're eating it with a fork, whatever.
KAYLA: Yes. But if I'm on a first or second date and it's like, let's go to this sushi place.
SARAH: Especially if they're like, if they have to ask for a fork.
KAYLA: Yes. Or if they don't even try the chopsticks.
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: Like they don't even put in an effort and they're like, oh man, I'm terrible. I think I'm going to say yes. I think I would get so secondhand embarrassed that I would be like, I can't.
SARAH: Yeah. I would say the only exception to this is if it's like for disability reasons, like they can't use chopsticks.
KAYLA: Yeah. Because at that point, I feel like I would be embarrassed to be seen with that person.
SARAH: Oh my god, only 41% of people said yes.
KAYLA: That sounds like a lot of those people don't know how to use chopsticks.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Is what I'm hearing.
SARAH: Or if you're going to be like, look, I can't use chopsticks. You should know this in advance.
KAYLA: Yeah, if you're self-deprecating about it and you're like, oh man, this is so embarrassing. But if you're like genuine.
SARAH: It was like me for most of my life because I couldn't take pills until I was like 20.
KAYLA: But at least you knew.
SARAH: And I was like, look, I know.
KAYLA: At least you knew.
SARAH: Me with eating, I know what I'm like.
KAYLA: You're self-aware.
SARAH: Yeah. Does biting the fork while eating give you the ick? Yes. Yes. Yes.
KAYLA: Ew, yes. Gross.
SARAH: My mom will bite spoons.
KAYLA: No, no, no.
SARAH: Like she'll be eating soup and she'll bite the spoon and it makes me want to jump into a pit of lava. Anyway, 63% of people agree with us. The 37% who said no are wrong.
KAYLA: Yeah, I don't know about that.
SARAH: Do V-neck shirts give you the ick? No.
KAYLA: No. What? If it's like a really deep V, maybe.
SARAH: If that's all they wear, I have questions.
KAYLA: I mean, you have to, I guess…
SARAH: But not ick.
KAYLA: No, I don't think so.
SARAH: 74% said no. Does people referring to themselves as a gentleman give you the ick?
KAYLA: Yes, because they're probably wearing a fedora
SARAH: If it's genuine.
KAYLA: Yes, if it's a bit, then it's like, ha ha ha.
SARAH: If it's a bit, or if they're like, it's me, a gentleman caller. Like that's, you know.
KAYLA: But no, if you're calling me…
SARAH: If you're fucking m’ladying me…
KAYLA: M’lady and you're a gentleman, then that's gross.
SARAH: 58% said yes. And finally, does mixing up their, there and they’re give you the ick?
KAYLA: If it's like persistent, yes.
SARAH: Yeah, for me, like.
KAYLA: If it's like a one- or two-time thing, it's like, okay, they did it.
SARAH: We all fuck up sometimes. You're and your also.
KAYLA: Yeah. But if you genuinely don't know your grammar, that's tough.
SARAH: Yeah. The only exception, I would say, is if you're dyslexic.
[00:30:00]
KAYLA: Yeah. Or if you're like, English is not your first language.
SARAH: Right. But… and like, I don't want to be like that bitch who's like, I can't date you because you're not smart enough.
KAYLA: I don't know that that has much to do with being smart.
SARAH: I think it's just, it just, it bothers me. Yes, that gives me the ick and 77% of people agree with us, which is funny because I don't think all 77% of those people actually know the difference.
KAYLA: Well, yeah.
SARAH: I don't believe that. This has been our quiz.
KAYLA: I feel like those are all very good examples of like very common icks, which again, like, they do seem like very, like, petty kind of like stupid reasons to stop seeing someone.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: But you also have to think about like if this is a first or second date. Like it makes...
SARAH: You're going on a lot of gut instincts.
KAYLA: Yeah. Because also, I think we talked about this, I don't know what episode it would have been, but we talked about how, like especially now with online dating and the way dating is, that there's just so many options.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: That sometimes people can get stuck in the loop of like, yeah, this person was like good overall, but like, what if this person is better?
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Or like they're able to be very, very nitpicky because they know that they have so many other options in the wings, which I feel like is why the ick is more like prevalent now because you have the luxury of getting the ick.
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: Whereas like for our grandparents, it was like, well, here's the five boys in my high school class and like, I'm going to just pick the one that annoys me the least.
SARAH: Pick one. Yeah. Yeah.
KAYLA: I do find it really interesting though that it's like all women talking about men.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Like do men get the ick?
SARAH: I don't know, man.
KAYLA: Here's my…
SARAH: I've heard of men getting the ick for other men, but I don't think I've ever really heard a…
KAYLA: Is it sexist for men to get the ick?
SARAH: Oh my God.
KAYLA: An article from GQ magazine. That's very funny. Let me see what they have to say.
SARAH: I think also a lot of it seems so surface level and unimportant, but at the end of the day you don't want to be with someone who you're embarrassed to be seen with
KAYLA: Yes
SARAH: Or who is embarrassed to be seen with you. Like there's a fundamental problem in your relationship if that is the case.
KAYLA: Right
SARAH: And so, it might seem like a super minor thing, but it's an indicator of probably something larger.
KAYLA: It probably points to something more. Well, I think also that kind of thing really grows. The example from the Cosmo article of the girl being like, he started being annoying and then it just got worse and worse over time and I couldn't stand him. I've been in friendships or relationships like that where it's like, once someone annoys you or is on your bad side, any little thing they do…
SARAH: Like one thing happens and suddenly it's like, oh my god.
KAYLA: Suddenly anything that anyone else could do it and it would be fine, but because that person is doing it, you're like, this person is the fucking worst, I can't believe they're breathing so loud.
SARAH: Yeah, exactly.
KAYLA: You know? Like, it's very bad. Let's see, let's see what this article has to say. Oh, so this guy is saying he got the ick because his date was saying that she really wanted to be Instagram famous.
SARAH: Yeah, that's ick worthy. And again, I think that points to a fundamental, if someone really wants to be famous, okay, if they become famous, it sounds like you don't want to be dating someone famous, so that's a point, you know. But then the other thing is, like, you know, there's a certain type of person who wants to be famous and a certain type of person who wants to be Instagram famous. And so, like, if they say that and you're like, that is not the kind of person that I see myself with, like, that's...
KAYLA: Well, he was saying, too, like, I'm not of the generation who speaks into the camera. So, it seems like he's just, like, not into that whole thing. I don't know.
SARAH: Mm-hmm
KAYLA: Okay, this guy got the ick. I'm interested to hear your thoughts on this. This guy got the ick after finding out that a girl he'd been dating kept a can of Coke by her bedside and drank from it every few hours.
SARAH: I mean, that's not ick worthy for me. It's funny.
KAYLA: Yeah. This guy got the ick because…
SARAH: Maybe tea
KAYLA: The girl called her father daddy in conversation.
SARAH: Oh, yes. Yes. That is a big ick. This girl, or this other guy was at this girl's house for the first time and she produced her pet hamster and he said his hamster was very cute but I knew that was it. Oh, this guy got the ick because she didn't know how to use chopsticks. The restaurant was just nice enough to render the request embarrassing for a fork.
SARAH: A lot of it too is just to do with shame. Like yeah, like when I…
KAYLA: Secondhand embarrassment I feel like for me is the main thing.
SARAH: Like when I was recently at a very nice genuine Italian restaurant in New York and I could tell based on the vibe. They had water and they had wine and the menu did not indicate any other beverage and I could just tell from the vibe that I was not to ask. I was not to inquire about any other beverage. I was going to either drink water or drink. I could tell that was the vibe.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: As much as I'm a very picky eater in an often embarrassing way, I also want to minimize embarrassment and shame at all times.
KAYLA: And you were situationally aware as a person.
SARAH: Yes, exactly. And so, at that same place, they brought us our food and they were giving Parmesan cheese and they were like, okay, would you like some? And my sister-in-law was like, I would like some please. And they were like, it doesn't go with the flavor profile of your pasta. And she was like, okay.
KAYLA: Jesus Christ
SARAH: So, she didn't get any. But then I was like, I kind of wanted some salt. But I was like, after that interaction no, no, no, no, no
KAYLA: No, no, no, no, no
SARAH: No, no, no, no, no, like I was like, okay, I'm reading the room. I mean, that's also part of the reason why I try and special-order stuff as little as possible. I want to not look like I'm a problem. And if someone is fine with being a problem, that's not a person that I want to be besties with personally.
KAYLA: It's interesting because this article is talking about, I guess this woman, I think maybe in a TikTok video, was saying that when women get the ick, it's normal. But when men get the ick, it's sexism. And they're just saying that among straight women, the ick is readily understood and unquestioned. But for men, it can be a lot harder to unpack. Like it's harder...
SARAH: It's like, is it really the ick or do I hate women?
KAYLA: Right. Which I under… like yeah, obviously men can get the ick. But I can understand why it is a thornier situation. Because women are allowed to hate men. I, notably, hate men. But men can't hate women.
SARAH: Right. When you are in the position of power
KAYLA: Yes
SARAH: It's in the same way that a black person can't be racist against a white person.
KAYLA: Right
SARAH: A black person can be prejudiced against a white person.
KAYLA: Can't be racist.
SARAH: But they are not in a position of power. So, they cannot be racist against a white person.
KAYLA: Right.
SARAH: It's the same situation.
KAYLA: Yes, 100%. Because, yeah, men are in… you know
SARAH: We live in a hegemonic society. She lives in a society. And I live in a museum.
KAYLA: And then there's other people in this article talking about, this person had other traits that normally would give me the ick, like bad fingernails. But she was like, I fancied him so much that he could have had no fingernails. So, I think that's a really interesting indication of like, it is truly someone that you're probably not compatible with. Because if you were truly vibing with them, you could look past certain smaller things.
SARAH: Yeah, which to me is why fundamental political beliefs are so different from what I view as the ick. Because you could like someone so much. But if I find out they're a fucking conservative, I'm sorry, no.
KAYLA: Yeah. Can I read you some icks from a list someone has compiled on TikTok?
SARAH: Yes
KAYLA: Chasing after a ping pong ball.
SARAH: Okay, someone has got to do it.
KAYLA: Sitting crisscross applesauce in his room on the floor, LED lights on... Okay, so by the way, these are specific examples that have happened to these women. This is a girl who shares a notes app with her friend.
SARAH: Yes
KAYLA: Sitting crisscross applesauce in his room on the floor, LED lights on, cutting the sleeves off of his t-shirt.
SARAH: I was with you until we got to the cutting his sleeves off of his t-shirt.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Are we talking like deep cut muscle tanks?
KAYLA: To me, it feels like the guys who cut the holes so big in the sides that there's a string attaching the sides of the shirt together. Yeah.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Not being able to open a jar and having to ask his mom for help.
SARAH: That is absolutely not an ick. What are you talking about?
KAYLA: I think it's funny. Making easy mac and forgetting to add water. Someone I know once did this and set the fire alarm off.
SARAH: It's like the one thing you're supposed to do.
KAYLA: You tell that to yourself. You did that in our dorm room.
SARAH: How confident are you in that?
KAYLA: It was either you or a Asritha.
SARAH: Because I didn't start eating easy mac until about six months ago.
KAYLA: Okay, maybe it was a Asritha then. Maybe it was our other friend in college. But someone definitely did. And it became an almost hazardous situation in the dorm.
SARAH: I have zero recollection of this. And I do not think it was me.
[00:40:00]
KAYLA: Okay.
SARAH: I did not start eating easy mac until this year.
KAYLA: I'll text Asritha about it later. We'll check in. Here's some other examples. Running into school with their backpack bouncing on their back.
SARAH: Okay
KAYLA: Eating applesauce with a spoon in public.
SARAH: What's wrong with that?
KAYLA: It's the ick. It does not fit Sarah. Laying out his outfit the night before school.
SARAH: That's cute.
KAYLA: Trying to hit a pinata and missing. Riding a bike.
SARAH: Just generally?
KAYLA: Wearing a quarter zip, but it zipped all the way up.
SARAH: Like all the way up?
KAYLA: Mm-hmm
SARAH: Oh, that's a little weird.
KAYLA: Trying to find a seat on the bus. Sarah, but the thing about icks is that they're not understandable. It's just a gut feeling.
SARAH: I know, but pretty much all of these I'm like, I just, this would not ick me.
KAYLA: Boys walking down a hill.
SARAH: Okay, but… these are just things people do. What were you expecting them to do otherwise?
KAYLA: Sarah, it's the ick. It just happens. When they have something in between their teeth. Hooded t-shirts. This I get. This I can kind of understand.
SARAH: Yeah, I don't like that.
KAYLA: Packing for a trip.
SARAH: Oh, no. They packed for a trip. I got the ick.
KAYLA: Standing in line to use a port-a-potty.
SARAH: They don't want to be butt ass naked on their trip. Oh, no.
KAYLA: Sock tan lines.
SARAH: Yeah. Okay. Did you see the thing about there was some event with a bunch of golfers and some fancy clothing company dressed them in suits, but they all gave them suits with the loafer shoes with no socks, but they all had really bad sock tans.
KAYLA: Oh, no. That's tough. Birkenstocks.
SARAH: Rude. No respect for the Germans.
KAYLA: Posting jump rope videos on Twitter while out of breath and grunting.
SARAH: Grunting is a bit much. Just turn the fucking audio off.
KAYLA: Sitting there with a wet towel on a temporary tattoo.
SARAH: I mean, I think that's remarkable.
KAYLA: The pouting, the oo-woo emoji.
SARAH: Like finger pointing?
KAYLA: No, no, just like the one with the big eyes. Like, you know?
SARAH: Okay, it depends.
KAYLA: Loud breathers. Pinterest. Okay, this is a very specific one.
SARAH: Okay
KAYLA: When you're in choir and he asks what song you're singing, what songs you're singing, so you tell him, In My Life by the Beatles, or this applies to literally any song, and then you get left on read for like 20 minutes. You're like, huh, that's weird. And then you get multiple videos from him, and you open them, and it's him playing In My Life on the piano.
SARAH: What?
KAYLA: That would give me the ick.
SARAH: That's weird.
KAYLA: Exactly.
SARAH: Okay.
KAYLA: Not skipping a stair. Skipping a stair. When he's standing and his feet are pointed either inwards or outwards.
SARAH: Must be directly forward.
KAYLA: When he's at a drive-through and they didn't hear him at first, so he has to repeat his order.
SARAH: That's not his fault.
KAYLA: When he has really good posture.
SARAH: Dude has got a fucking straight spine. We can't.
KAYLA: Wispy mustaches. That's fair.
SARAH: Mm
KAYLA: Being shit on by a bird. No bedsheets or pillowcases. Fair.
SARAH: Yeah
KAYLA: Peeing sitting down.
SARAH: How would you know that?
KAYLA: Anyway, those are some examples.
SARAH: Wow. Okay. Well, I think that just about covers it.
KAYLA: I agree. I mean, I think that last list is a good example of when you look at it from just the examples, you can be like, okay, this is just people being kind of assholes.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: And maybe people do take it too far as a joke or whatever. But at its root, it makes complete sense.
SARAH: Yeah, it's a vibe check.
KAYLA: Yeah, it's a vibe check. Sometimes people are going to do shit that you're just like, I, the attraction is gone.
SARAH: It’s just gone. Sometimes they're going to skip a step, and sometimes they're not going to skip a step, and they're both wrong.
KAYLA: And there's nothing you can do about it.
SARAH: They have to take an elevator.
KAYLA: I guess.
SARAH: All right. What's our poll for this week?
KAYLA: What's something that gives you the ick?
SARAH: Yeah, what's something that gives you the ick, or theoretically would give you the ick?
KAYLA: Yeah, yeah. And I think you could get like icks around potential friends too.
SARAH: Yeah, of course.
KAYLA: Just like any new person you meet. I feel like it doesn't have to be romantic or sexual attraction that gets instantly lost.
SARAH: Right. It could be like, what would give me the ick?
KAYLA: For like a new friend?
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: I don't know.
SARAH: Someone who is judgy about my eating habits.
KAYLA: That's fair. Again though, I think that's maybe further than an ick.
SARAH: I think that's further than an ick, yeah.
KAYLA: That's just someone being rude.
SARAH: Yeah. Someone who only wears above the ankle socks.
KAYLA: Okay.
SARAH: Like not…
KAYLA: Like crew socks.
SARAH: Like crew socks.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Someone who only… I really don't like crew socks.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: I find them very upsetting.
KAYLA: It is interesting if that's like the only thing in your sock wardrobe too.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Yeah, I can… I guess.
SARAH: You were wearing them yesterday and I was triggered.
KAYLA: No, I wasn't.
SARAH: Are we thinking of the same socks?
KAYLA: How high?
SARAH: Show me your foot.
KAYLA: I do have socks that like go up to here.
SARAH: Yeah, those ones.
KAYLA: Okay. I thought we were talking about like…
SARAH: No, I don't mean crew crew. I mean like above the ankle bone, but not…
KAYLA: Okay.
SARAH: Like, you know.
KAYLA: That's fair. I don't love them either. They're just the socks that I have.
SARAH: I keep getting ads for the brand Double Soul socks, except they keep giving me ads for their like whatever they are above the ankles and they piss me off. I get so mad.
KAYLA: I'm very sorry. Now I feel self-conscious about the fact that those are some of the socks I have.
SARAH: Well, I'm very sorry. They upset me. What are they called? Ankle crew socks?
KAYLA: They might be ankle socks because the ones lower than that might technically be no-show socks.
SARAH: No, but no-show socks are often lower.
KAYLA: I know, but I don't know.
SARAH: I also find it very upsetting because some of the socks I have, to get them to be on my feet properly in the way that is required in my narrow, spicy way, I have to pull them up so that they're almost that high anyway. And then I find that really upsetting.
KAYLA: I'm really sorry.
SARAH: I want them to shrink, but they're not shrinking.
KAYLA: Yeah, well. Usually, I feel like socks get bigger, if anything, over time. So.
SARAH: Okay.
KAYLA: Okay.
SARAH: Okay, what's your beef and your juice for this week?
KAYLA: My beef is that Los Angeles is very hot. I don't like that about it.
SARAH: Mm-hmm
KAYLA: Yeah. My juice is we had Chipotle today. That was really yummy. And we did a good job this week. And we took a nap almost every day.
SARAH: Mm-hmm
KAYLA: Yep.
SARAH: My beef is that your flight is at 8am tomorrow.
KAYLA: I'm sorry. I'm making us get up so early tomorrow.
SARAH: We have to leave at 5:30.
KAYLA: I honestly have no excuse for myself. I don't have anything to say.
SARAH: And then I think I'm just going to go straight to work because...
KAYLA: Just take a little nap. No one will be there.
SARAH: Yeah, because there's no point in me driving all the way home.
KAYLA: Just be the person that sits in your car, take a little car nap.
SARAH: All the way home and then driving all the way back the direction I came from.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: My juice is that the green apples I was given were not too sour.
KAYLA: Yeah, there was a concern
SARAH: I am not a green apple girlie. And I was really concerned that they would be way too sour for me. But they were not. They were okay.
KAYLA: Yeah
SARAH: So. All right. You can tell us about your beef, your juice, your icks on our social media @SoundsFakePod. We also have a Patreon, patreon.com/soundsfakepod if you'd like to support us there. We have some $5 patrons. And you know, I've said this person every week for like two weeks, three weeks now. But I have heard from our friend Riven how to pronounce their last name.
KAYLA: Okay
SARAH: It's apparently Lias. It's Greek.
KAYLA: Oh, sexy.
SARAH: It's L-I-H-O-S, but it's pronounced Lias. Tell me if I did that wrong. Our other $5 patrons are Claire Olsen, Colleen Walsh, Doug Rice, and Edward Hayes Holgate. And there's a bunch more, but those are the ones we're saying this week. Kayla is on her phone. She's so disrespectful. Our $10 patrons who are promoting something this week are my aunt Jeannie, who would like to promote Christopher's Haven. Maff, who would like to promote the Don't Should sweatshirt. Martin Giselle, who would like to promote his album Lo-Fi Beats to Dream to. Parker, who would like to promote You Just Lost the Game.
KAYLA: Oh, I saw that they asked for this and I hated it.
SARAH: You lost the game, Kayla. Parker, That's on you. And Purple Haze, who would like to promote their friend's podcast, The Host Club. Our other $10 patrons are the Barefoot Backpacker, Songastorm, Allison, Ani, Ani, Ani. I haven't decided how I'm saying your name yet. Arcness, Benjamin, Ybarra, Boston Smith, Selena Dobson, David Harris, Derek, and Karessa, Albeta, and that's it. Our $15 patrons are @MO, our $15 patrons are Ace, who would like to promote the Writer Crystal Share. Andrew Hillam, who would like to promote the Invisible Spectrum podcast, Dia Chappelle, who would like to promote Twitch.tv/Melanidia. Hector Murillo, who would like to promote Friends that are Supportive and Supportive and Healthy you grow as a better person. Daniel White, who would like to promote the Fanatuaida.com. MKLZ and Ino would like to promote Kate Maggart. No, KateMaggartArt.com. Our $20 patron is Dragonfly, who would like to promote the fact that I thought of something like a minute ago and then I forgot it.
KAYLA: It's gone now.
[00:50:00]
SARAH: It's gone. Um, Dragonfly would like to promote naps. Thanks for listening. Tune in next Sunday for more of us in your ears.
KAYLA: And until then, take good care of your cows.
[END OF TRANSCRIPT]