Ep 191: Giving Relationship Advice to Reddit
(00:00)
SARAH: Hey what’s up hello. Welcome to Sounds Fake But Okay, a podcast where an aroace girl (I’m Sarah. That’s me.)
KAYLA:… and a demisexual girl (that’s me, Kayla)
SARAH: talk about all things to do with love, relationships, sexuality, and pretty much anything else that we just don’t understand.
KAYLA: On today’s episode: relationship advice.
ALL: — Sounds fake, but okay.
SARAH: Welcome back to the pod!
KAYLA: Mmm….aaaaa….m’ariachi, I’ve already done that I’m pretty sure.
SARAH: You could have just said m’y cat is trying to get into the garbage.
KAYLA: It’s true m’y cat is trying to get into the garbage. I don’t know why. All day she’s not wanted to be in the room with me because Dean is working from home today so she’s been hanging out with Dean. As soon as I closed the door to record, she became very interested in being in this room and causing a ruckus.
SARAH: She wants the fame and fortune.
KAYLA: She wants something. And that something is to be put out on the street.
SARAH: Mmkay. Do we have any housekeeping? We recently hit 6,000 followers on Twitter. I happened to notice that.
KAYLA: We did and then it went back down and now it’s back up again.
SARAH: I was going to say, usually over the course of 12 hours, we’ll gain at least one. So I thought it was odd that we were at exactly 6,000 does that mean someone unfollowed and someone refollowed?
KAYLA: We’re at 6,001 now but I noticed a couple days ago we were at 6,000 but then I noticed that we weren’t but now we are again.
SARAH: Kay, cool.
KAYLA: There’s a cat on my desk looking mischievous.
SARAH: Cool. Anything else? I think that’s it. I’m glad people seemed to enjoy last week’s hellhole episode.
KAYLA: Our relaxcast? We just got—no ma’am—*screaming noises*—oh my god she’s getting kicked out right now. She just took a push pin out of my wall with her mouth and it fell into her mouth and there’s a push pin in her mouth.
SARAH: Oh my god. How much of your mic just picked that up?
KAYLA: All of it.
SARAH: Good. Cause I need the people to know.
KAYLA: I’m sure it was very loud, I screamed right into my mic.
SARAH: Oh, push pin in the cat’s mouth, wow.
KAYLA: She literally picked out a push pin with her mouth perfectly and was holding it and in me trying to get it out it fell in deeper. She’s fine, nothing happened, she’s just a piece of shit. Anyway. It’s our birthday soon.
SARAH: Oh that’s not what we were talking about but that is true.
KAYLA: Exciting things to come for our birthday.
SARAH: And also people seemed to enjoy the relaxcast even though they said it wasn’t very relaxing.
KAYLA: We got a DM today on Twitter of someone saying that they found it very relaxing.
SARAH: That’s good. Mixed reviews.
KAYLA: They said, “the voices and atmosphere felt very nice. It was chill and low energy.”
SARAH: Mm. Fun.
KAYLA: And they said it was a good idea of something to do when you can’t do anything. Or something else. And I was like thank you.
SARAH: We’re geniuses basically. But no you’re right. Our birthday is coming up, we’re going to be four years old.
KAYLA: Four years old on the 31st. Is the 31st a Sunday?
SARAH: I don’t know.
KAYLA: It is a Saturday. Anyway, exciting things to come for our birthday.
SARAH: Yes! Cool. Kayla, what are we talking about this week?
KAYLA: This week, we’re diving back into Reddit. But this time to give some advice.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Not to see if people are assholes. Though I do want to do that again at some point. I found that very fun.
SARAH: I picked out some ones and I feel like there are a couple people—there are assholes involved. So.
KAYLA: I mean there’s always—
SARAH: An asshole.
KAYLA: Always an asshole somewhere. I am always saying that.
SARAH: Do you want me to dive in? Just start?
KAYLA: So what Reddit did you get these from?
SARAH: They are from relationship_advice on Reddit.
KAYLA: And I’m pretty sure this episode idea came from Barefoot Backpacker.
SARAH: It came from someone in our Discord.
KAYLA: I’m pretty sure it was Barefoot Backpacker.
SARAH: In the cord. I have six of them pulled up. I think they all relate to the aspec directly or little bit more tangentially. I don’t know which to do first so I’d like you to give me a number between 1 and 6.
(5:00)
KAYLA: Ooh. 4.
SARAH: 4. That’s actually the one I’m currently sitting on. Okay.
KAYLA: You shouldn’t sit on it. Probably not very comfortable.
SARAH: Okay, this one says and we will link all of these again. I won’t close them this time. This one says, “I (31m) am questioning my engagement after learning about my fiancé’s (28f) past relationships.”
KAYLA: Okay.
SARAH: “I recently learned that my fiancé was not entire honest about her past ‘relationships’. I overheard her talking with a friend on a video chat and it turns out my fiancé slept with at least 50 or 60 guys before me, and at least half of those were one night stands. The rest were all flings or friends with benefits or something like that. She is now 28 and I am her first and only serious relationship. The relationship is pretty good. The number of partners is not exactly what’s bothering me. I would estimate that I’ve been with about 25 to 30 women, but I’ve only ever had two one night stands. She waited until our tenth date before we had sex. What is bothering me is that she gave herself away SO easily to so many guys and I am literally the first guy that had to work for it. In the beginning, I got the impression that this was a standard policy for her, that she made every guy put in a lot of work to be with her and it made me feel really special. I would say we have a good relationship. She tells me how great I am and I’ve never felt disrespected but now I am feeling like the special connection I thought we had never existed. We met on a dating app and she said that she felt this instant connection between us. Our messaging conversation flowed effortlessly and she wanted us to have something special and unique. How do I come to terms with this situation? What we have just doesn’t feel as special anymore now that I know she slept with other men so easily but only made me work harder. Sent from my iPad.”
KAYLA: Shouldn’t that make you feel more special?
SARAH: This blows my mind. Everyone in the replies is like, “what the fuck is wrong with you?” I like that this person gives the disclaimer that it’s not the number of partners, it’s the number of partners.
KAYLA: I mean it clearly is the number of partners. I’m not understanding—cause it seems to me, if she’s had a ton of hookups and one night stands but it seems like—he’s her only serious long-term relationship she’s had, that he is very special. And she made him “work for it” because she knew it was special and didn’t want it to be a hookup like everything else.
SARAH: Exactly.
KAYLA: To me it seems even more special at that point.
SARAH: Also at this point, you’re engaged.
KAYLA: Obviously what you have is very special. I’m assuming she’s never been engaged before.
SARAH: This is her first and only serious relationship, I highly doubt she’s been engaged before.
KAYLA: It seems like it clearly is the number that’s bothering him and he’s trying to make it seem like it’s not because the reasons he’s saying that he’s upset don’t logically make sense because to me it feels like he should feel even more special.
SARAH: Exactly.
KAYLA: It makes sense to me if she felt a genuine emotional connection with him and was like, “oh I don’t want to fuck this up, I don’t want a casual hookup like I did before, it seems like I want to date this guy and see him more than one time.”
SARAH: Right.
KAYLA: You know, not that there’s anything wrong with either option, either hooking up or having a long-term thing. It’s just that if this is her first of that, how is that not special? She’s literally never done it before.
SARAH: Well it seems to me like this guy dated around a lot and so he had sex with women but he was dating. But he didn’t view them as one night stands and for some reason that’s different for him than what she did. Which is like, is it that different. And this comment from sleepyflowerr says “Your phrasing ‘give herself away so easily’ is a bit toxic. She's a human being, not a product. She made choices for herself and they had nothing to do with you. Do you also get upset when you find out other people ate your favorite kind of cereal? You're looking too deep into something that isn't even there. She chose to be with you long term and is with you now, that's all that should matter.”
KAYLA: The wording of “made me work for it” I don’t love that either. There are other ways to say that that are not.
SARAH: Yeah. This comment from Taryntalia goes, “I'm questioning your engagement too, truly think she should run.” This person’s like, “Shouldn't you be happy that she is treating you differently? She didn't go out with you with the intention of a one night stand, hence she didn't sleep with you right away. That's a GOOD thing. She saw long-term potential. You're engaged and you're mad that you had to wait 10 whole dates before getting laid. Wtf. Kinda starting to wonder what even made you propose, since it now seems like you only care about sex. our whole post points out red flags about you, not her.”
(10:00)
KAYLA: That is very true. It seems like his—the whole revolving around feeling special but she’s had sex with this many people does make it seem like he values the sex in the relationship a lot when it’s obviously the emotional connection that makes their relationship different and special from what she has had before.
SARAH: Yeah. This comment from deskbookcandle says, “Today I learned that getting to know your future life partner and treating them nicely is ‘work’.”
KAYLA: If anyone were to be upset, I don’t know, to me if she has that much experience with other guys and chose him, everything points to him being—
SARAH: The asshole.
KAYLA: Well, yes. But him being the one special person to her. If she’s had sex with 50 guys she had the choice of any of them and chose him.
SARAH: And let me tell you. If she’s had sex with 50 or 60 guys, the odds that her fiance is the best fuck out of all of them are honestly not good.
KAYLA: No! Absolutely not.
SARAH: So, she’s clearly staying with him for a lot of reasons. Obviously, if she had sex with a lot of other people and there’s a reason she didn’t stick around with them, and there’s a reason she is sticking around with him whereas he’s like, mm.
KAYLA: Yeah cause good sex does not equal a good marriage, which is what I’m assuming they would like to have. This guy is an asshole.
SARAH: I know. I told you there were assholes.
KAYLA: It’s clearly the number that he’s upset about whether he wants to admit that to himself or others.
SARAH: Yeah the top comment from not-so-desperate says, “Men are strange. Like women can fuck whoever they want. And reserve the right to change their ‘policies’ at any time. Maybe she was ready to get serious and settle down. She didn’t give anything away. She fucked.” That is correct.
KAYLA: This one should be in r/amitheasshole. They put this in the wrong subreddit.
SARAH: Yeah you are the asshole.
KAYLA: Cause he is the asshole. God, what a piece of shit.
SARAH: Yeah I know, truly an asshole. Okay, give me another number between 1 and 6.
KAYLA: 2.
SARAH: 2. Mmkay. This one is interesting. This one is the one that I think is least directly connected to sex or—okay, we’ll see, let me just read it. The title is, “Boyfriend (25) weight gain turning me off (F/24).”
KAYLA: Ohghghhh.
SARAH: “A bit of backstory. When I started dating my boyfriend he was thin but not physically fit or toned. I didn’t mind that and was very attracted to him. We have now been dating for 3.5 years and he has slowly gained weight since. He now visibly shows signs of being out of shape and his clothes don’t fit the same. I dropped subtle hints to go to the gym and eat better but they were missed. I sat him down over a year ago and told him I would like him to make more effort to look better for me. I encouraged team efforts to lessen the blow. This resulted in a full-on argument as he accused me of calling him a ‘slob’. Unfortunately the fact of the matter is he has turned into a slob. Conversations like this have persisted and he says he’ll eat better / work out but then stops after one day. I stopped badgering him about it because he went through a hard time at Christmas 2020. Since then he has been better so I brought up the topic again, which resulted in another argument and he reminded me that ‘his weight has nothing to do with me’. I thought this was wrong as I think physical appearances matter and maintaining them maintains interest, especially in a 3.5 year relationship. I work out 3 times a week as I like to look good for myself and my boyfriend. My boyfriend is really sensitive to comments about his weight, I’m no longer sexually attracted to him but I think his lack of effort is what’s annoying me the most. I used to be like him- sensitive about being overweight and out of shape. But I realized pouting about it achieves nothing, only hard work can fix it. I was out recently and saw a random guy with his top off and he was in great shape, I’m ashamed to say I have been fantasizing about him instead of my boyfriend. I love my boyfriend a lot and want to be with him but I’m not physically attracted to him. I have tried to tiptoe around the topic and I have been forthright. I’m tired of it and his complaints about being fat then doing nothing about it. What else can I say when he’s already highly sensitive to the topic and thinks I am a nag?”
KAYLA: MMmmhmmmmm.
(15:00)
SARAH: It’s really interesting looking at the comments. Basically, let me just read you the top comment. It says, “You're allowed to be turned off by his weight. He's allowed to not change anything about it. If he doesn't care about his weight or not enough to change something then I don't know if you can convince him to work out. You can still try though and tell him how it's affecting the relationship. Maybe this will be a wake-up call. But if he doesn't want to, you can't force him and then you have to decide if he's enough the way he is or if you'd rather break up. I'm sorry, this is no easy situation.” And a lot of people in the comments are saying you know—like this person is saying “You’re absolutely allowed to need physical attraction in your relationship. The majority of people do.” I don’t know. But if you really loved this person that much. Sure maybe he looked better when he was younger but is that a reason to break up with him? That seems a little extreme to me.
KAYLA: I think it depends on how much sex matters to you in a relationship. Because I do understand that physical attraction does factor into sexual attraction, that is how it works for a lot of people. And if she is not as physically attracted to him if he’s “overweight,” that’s not something she can control. Also, you can’t just tell someone that they’re fat and you hate it.
SARAH: I also just hate the mindset—and I know some people are like this but this person has the mindset that I like to look good for myself and my boyfriend. “I would like him to make more effort to look better for me.” I just don’t think that’s what the point should ever be of a relationship. I like to think I’m a little more objective on this than the average person because I am aroace and am separate for this but at the same time there’s some of it that I just don’t fully understand. I don’t know, it’s hard.
KAYLA: I get it to a certain extent. Sometimes if me and Dean are going out, I will want to dress up both for me because I don’t get that many opportunities to go out but also to be like oh I want to go out I want to look nice for this thing we’re doing. I get it to a certain extent but to me the bigger concern should be if you think he is eating badly or being a slob or whatever, if it was a concern about his health, you’re not eating healthy and you’re not moving ever—
SARAH: Or your “slobbery” is a result of a decrease in mental health that’s another issue.
KAYLA: That I can understand, “hey I want you to eat better and exercise for your physical and mental health not necessarily because I think you look bad”—
SARAH: Or I think you need to lose weight. Or whatever.
KAYLA: Dean yells at me all the time about my health habits, about me working out and eating better not because he doesn’t like how I look but because I am truly a very unhealthy person. And that’s one thing. I feel like the top comment has part of it, pretty valid. You’re allowed to be less attracted to him but he’s allowed to not give a shit.
SARAH: Yeah, I don’t know. It’s just really hard for me. All these people, they’re not wrong in saying that sexual attraction matters to some people but the aroace part of me looks at that like, I cannot believe that it would matter so much that it would be worth breaking up over something like this. I can’t quite wrap my head around it. And maybe that’s the aroace in me, maybe it’s this person being superficial, I don’t know. But, I don’t know.
KAYLA: I think it’s hard because I do think that it’s part of the aspec person in you not understanding or fully sympathizing I guess when sex is a bigger part of relationships. I have a hard time with that too because I don’t find sex to be the most important part in my relationships. But it’s hard because especially when she’s saying he’s insecure about talking about this kind of thing, you bothering him and not bringing it up and not being supportive is not going to help anyone. That’s going to make him feel worse. He’s already not feeling great about the subject.
SARAH: On one hand she’s right in saying “But I realized pouting about it achieves nothing, only hard work can fix it.” That is objectively right. I don't think that’s what he needs to hear right now.
(20:00)
KAYLA: That’s like telling someone, oh you can choose to be happy. You can just choose to be not upset about something. You know?
SARAH: It’s not that easy.
KAYLA: It’s not that easy to find motivation to work out or be healthy or whatever. It’s a hard thing to get yourself to do especially if you’re not in a mentally great place or something.
SARAH: The only thing that’s gotten me to work out more recently is the validation from Papa Tim Cook telling me that I’ve done a good job on my Apple Watch.
KAYLA: The only thing that has ever given me full motivation to work out was in sophomore year of college, I did a Tough Mudder event with my then boyfriend and his family and I was so worried about being embarrassed in front of his family about doing a bad job cause they did it every year that I went to the gym three times a week to avoid embarrassment. Embarrassment and social pressure of that kind is the only thing that’s ever made me consistently be healthy.
SARAH: I’m just like, I want to earn a meaningless little award from my Apple Watch.
KAYLA: And I’m like, I need to not be murdered in public.
SARAH: Incredible.
KAYLA: That one’s tough. I also, as someone who has the privilege of a person who is average-sized I guess that’s also hard to speak to.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: Not average size, like societally accepted size.
SARAH: Yeah. You know what’s really fucking stupid? One of our friends recently was talking about how they recently made the mistake of looking up what their BMI was and comparing to what the supposed standard is.
KAYLA: Never do that.
SARAH: They were like oh it says overweight. And I was like what the fuck if you’re overweight then I’m overweight. And I checked and it does say I’m overweight.
KAYLA: I remember me and Dean got into an argument. When vaccines started getting more public in Louisiana, it was like at first if you have XYZ health issue you can get one. And if you are overweight that was part of it and he because of his BMI was technically overweight. I was getting mad at him for getting a vaccine when it wasn’t his time yet, then we had this whole argument of him being like, “well technically I am overweight.” And I was like, look at you. You’re not fat.
SARAH: BMI, the actual body mass index itself there isn’t necessarily a problem with. But when you start putting it into categories of this is normal, this is overweight, this is whatever and those categories are based on old fucking racist shit, then it’s absurd. Anyway. That’s all. Okay, number 1 through 6.
KAYLA: 6.
SARAH: This one’s pretty short. It says, “How do I [24M] come in peace with being forever alone?” “How can one come in peace with actually never having a SO? For most of my life I kinda felt entitled to having a SO of mine or even potentially a family. However, after realizing that I just don't have what it takes to actually attract and interest people, in romantic terms, I just completely gave up on the idea. And now I will just focus on making the world and society a better place for all of us. But it's still really tough to know that SO or a family is something that you will never have. Any advice would be really highly appreciated.”
SARAH: All of the comments are like, you’re 24 what the fuck are you talking about?
KAYLA: This sounds like a textbook logic of an incel. Even down to saying “I’m going to focus on making the world a better place,” while the sentiment is—it feels very self-serving and feels like something an incel would say. Am I wrong?
SARAH: It feels like an incel who thinks that they have come to peace, come to terms, but actually—
KAYLA: But clearly have not.
SARAH: Right.
KAYLA: Them being like “oh I thought for a while I was entitled to this but now I know I don’t.” No. You do.
SARAH: Now I know I don't have what it takes to actually attract and interest people. How do you fucking know that? You’re 24.
KAYLA: This is absolutely an incel.
SARAH: For sure. It blows my—it’s a self-fulfilling prophecy too. If you’re like oh I’ll never find someone then of course you’ll never find someone.
(25:00)
KAYLA: Well yeah, if you’re going to say I don’t have what it takes to attract people, I’m going to stop trying, well yeah then you’re not going to attract people if you’re you know.
SARAH: This person commented saying, “Often times, we look for qualities in other people to ‘complete’ us because we lack strength in those areas. Rather than find someone who completes you, look for someone who compliments you.” I think that’s a good way to think of a relationship because my whole other half, you complete me. I hate it. I hate it.
KAYLA: Yeah. I just don’t—at any age but especially when you’re 24, there are people who don’t get married or start dating until they’re much older than 24.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: You’re a quarter of the way through your life. It’s not like it’s over.
SARAH: We’re roughly the same age as this person. I am a baby. I’m a child.
KAYLA: There’s so many ahead. So many.
SARAH: These comments are—bumblebeequeer says, “You could stop being such a fucking martyr, for one thing. Sorry to be harsh, but this “woe is me” attitude is not getting you anywhere, and it’s probably what’s driving people away.”
KAYLA: It’s like the classic pick me boy of oh well you probably don’t like me, I’m just a nice guy, girls like—you know, it’s that whole thing of whatever. No one’s going to like you if you have that attitude about it.
SARAH: This person says, “Why do you feel you don't have what it takes? Speaking frankly, there are many many sub-par people who are in relationships.”
KAYLA: And that’s fair.
SARAH: That’s fair. That’s not even a “oh some people who are less attractive.” No there are some real assholes.
KAYLA: I feel like it always is the assholes too. I feel like in high school it was always people who were not great in whatever fashion that would date—and they would be dating other people that were not great. You find each other, you know?
SARAH: And OP responds to this, “Not up to physical standards of beauty and personality. I mean I have TONS of hobbies and quite a decent physique. However, I don't believe that it's really enough.” What the fuck. And this person comments—
KAYLA: Ugly people find ugly people all the time, if that’s his worry. There’s someone else that’s also ugly too. If that’s your worry.
SARAH: Maybe you’re trying to punt above your weight. Niceguy4evahnot, OP. Also there’s one comment that goes, “Good christ. That attitude is WHY you'll be alone. You sound pitiful and it's not attractive. Work on yourself and just learn to be happy as you are and the rest will follow suit.” And OP responds, “Dude I literally said that I'm not looking for pity or advice on finding and SO. I mentioned clearly that all I'm looking for is an advice on how to be peaceful on my own.” Which is fair but it’s a self-fulfilling prophecy. You’re talking about it in a way that’s pitying. All you could have said is I’m having trouble with the fact that I’m single, or whatever.
KAYLA: Or the fear of being alone. Lots of people have the fear of being alone forever without making it sound that bad. The worry of being alone forever is something I very much understand. I think aspec people and allo people alike have that worry for different reasons.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: And finding peace with that is a real thing that is good to do but this person doesn’t seem quite ready or there yet.
SARAH: Yeah this one person’s like, “There's a big difference between "I can be ok on my own" and ‘I'll never find love.’” Yeah. And OP’s like, “I completely agree. But how can I become okay on my own though?” Well maybe that’s what you should have asked to begin with.
KAYLA: I don’t personally become how you become okay on your own because it’s something I have avoided for my entire life but I fully grant that that is very difficult. I just feel like I don't trust that this man genuinely—
SARAH: Is being genuine in their—
KAYLA: I feel like there’s people that are going to respond to this part of the podcast and be like “you’re being too mean” blah blah blah and maybe, but.
(30:00)
SARAH: I don’t know. It’s just I appreciate that they’re like trying to come to terms with the fact that you don't have to do what society tells you but it feels like the reason that they’re coming to terms with this is because they feel like they have to because they’re like, oh I’m not good enough, no one will ever love me. And it’s like no.
KAYLA: I think the problem for me is that I don’t inherently trust that they’re trying to become okay with that. It just feels like they’re here for pity whether they say they don’t want pity or not, I just don’t trust them.
SARAH: And their @ is niceguy4evahnot so that concerns me.
KAYLA: So there’s a lot of red flags here. I don't know, I just don’t trust it, that’s all.
SARAH: Yeah, I don’t trust it either. Give me another number 1 through 6.
KAYLA: Have we done 1?
SARAH: Nope. Okay. This one is titled, “Should I tell the In-Laws about my wife's fertility lie?” “Me and my wife are early 30s, have been married for just a year. Yup COVID screwed our wedding and honeymoon plans. After discussing our future and ages we stopped using birth control shortly after the I Do’s. The problem is my wife had nearly zero sex drive. In our 14 months of marriage, we averaged two sexual encounters a month. And from my limited knowledge of the menstrual cycle, the wrong times to expect conception. I’m surprisingly okay with my basically celibate marriage, handling my sex drive manually when needed. However, my wife has spent the past year telling every friend, family, and marginal acquaintance that we are trying to have a baby or trying to start a family. On a few occasions I have privately confronted her that no we really haven’t but she is better at debate and I usually end up feeling guilty for shaming my wife for her low sex drive. We have recently begun the process for foster care which I think is a more viable option for us beginning a family. But last week she got depressed due to the number of women she knows are pregnant when she hasn’t been blessed with a child. I had a difficult time sympathizing with her because unless she’s expecting immaculate conception, what does she think prayer will accomplish? TL;DR wife expects to get pregnant without having sex.”
KAYLA: I mean is there just a nice way to suggest maybe let’s plan our sex better? Not even to say, let’s have more sex, like, hey let’s use a tracking app, go to the doctor and make sure we’re having sex at the right times.
SARAH: Yeah, if you’re really actually trying to have a baby there are so many books about how to best do that. It doesn’t—this also look, I don’t understand the allosexuals and I don’t have a grasp on how much they have sex but the person is like, my wife has had nearly zero sex drive we average 2 sexual encounters a month. Which like, I don’t know.
KAYLA: I wouldn’t say that’s nearly celibate like he’s saying.
SARAH: That sounds like—I don’t know how much people normally have sex especially if it’s their first year of marriage. I’m sure it’s different then than it’s going to be 15 years down the lane but that doesn’t—hmm?
KAYLA: That doesn’t seem like a problem to me personally.
SARAH: To me, zero sex drive or nearly zero sex drive would be like once or twice a year maybe.
KAYLA: We’re not getting the full context, maybe it’s two sexual encounters a month that he’s asking to initiate. Or you know maybe she really does have a low sex drive.
SARAH: But, he’s saying from my limited knowledge of the menstrual cycle, the wrong times to expect conception. So if he knows that they’re trying for a kid and he’s the one who’s instigating so maybe he should talk to her to try and do it at the right time so that she could actually get pregnant.
KAYLA: Yeah I feel like if you’re really trying to get pregnant, especially when you’re in your 30s when it starts getting harder I think, I don’t really know how getting pregnant works, but either way for some people it’s harder to get pregnant so you have to do all of that planning, “here are the days we need to have sex at least once, here are the days I’m fertile, whatever.” I know that he said she’s better at debate than him and he feels guilty or whatever, I feel like there’s gotta be a way to be like, “I’m not saying we should have more sex I’m just saying we should have strategic sex, you know?”
SARAH: No I agree. He’s saying “on a few occasions I’ve confronted her that we really haven’t” in regards to trying to have a baby but I don’t think confronting her is the answer.
KAYLA: That’s not going to do anything.
SARAH: Yeah I think the answer is saying, “if you do want to get pregnant and have your own biological child with me, how can we better set ourselves up for that?” And if they’re going the foster care route, wonderful. I think that’s great. There are so many kids in foster care who need people to care for them I think that’s wonderful. But if she really does want to get pregnant and have her own child, it seems like you’re not pulling your weight either bud.
KAYLA: Yeah it just seems like there’s a lack of communication on all sides. It almost seems like he secretly is mad about her “low sex drive.”
SARAH: Well cause he also says “I’m surprisingly okay with my basically celibate marriage.” Also “basically celibate,” you said two sexual encounters a month, how is that basically celibate?
KAYLA: It seems like it’s him using this as an excuse because if the pregnancy thing was really a problem, go to a doctor, get some books, be more strategic.
SARAH: Yeah. And maybe these were the sorts of people who had no sex before marriage sort of thing, and so maybe they didn’t know this before they got married but if they did have sex before they got married I feel like he would have known these things about—unless something really suddenly changed in her sex drive. He should have maybe seen this coming to a certain extent.
KAYLA: It just doesn’t—
SARAH: “After discussing our future and ages we stopped using birth control shortly after the I Do’s,” implying that they had been having sex prior to the marriage but also implying that prior to the marriage they had been using birth control.
KAYLA: It’s just got to be, if pregnancy is your real aim and is the real issue, there should be a real way to do it hopefully without argument.
SARAH: Yeah.
KAYLA: I don’t know fam. It’s hard without the full context for all of these but I feel like that’s even more—cause maybe he does bring these things up rationally and maybe he’s just being irrational about it. I don’t know.
SARAH: Oh interesting, so this person says, “I think your wife probably says that's happening because it's expected in general that if you get married, that means baby is the next step. The second my cousin got married (the night of, actually), everyone was asking when she was having kids. She chose to be childfree. I highly doubt your wife thinks she can get pregnant without having sex, but I think the two of you need to talk more clearly about your options. She also might consider talking to a doctor about conceiving and her sex drive.” And OP responds and says, “A very fair point about expectations. I had noticed that her sex drive actually decreased when we started trying for conception, being marginally higher beforehand. I did ask her if she was certain about the baby plan, based on her reaction. However, I was never fully convinced.”
KAYLA: I mean she could be lying. I have a friend that recently got engaged and she told me that even wearing your engagement ring in public, strangers will be like, “oh my god congratulations, when are you getting married, when are you going to have a baby?” Like strangers. So, I mean maybe she doesn’t actually want to have a child or a child born naturally or whatever. And she’s just putting that pressure on herself. It’s possible.
SARAH: Yeah. And this person goes, “Can she ask her doctor if there’s anything that can be done for either her low sex drive or artificially inseminating her with your sperm?” And then this guy says, “Now I feel ashamed. I had never considered that there could be a medical cause for her inaction.”
KAYLA: Okay, well...
SARAH: That’s getting a bit sticky.
KAYLA: Now it’s getting bad.
SARAH: We haven’t done 3 or 5. Give me one.
KAYLA: What?
SARAH: Pick a number, 3 or 5.
KAYLA: Three!
SARAH: Okay. “My boyfriend has no sex drive and I don't know what to do.” It seems like we kind of really.
KAYLA: We really saved em for the end.
(40:00)
SARAH: We brought all of the sex drive ones together. Okay. Let me fly through this one it’s a bit long. My boyfriend (27M) has never really had a big sex drive our whole relationship, but it seems so much lower these days. We've been together now for nearly 3yr and it's gotten worse over that time. This is my (23F) first real relationship so I came in with very little experience. Since this is my first real relationship, I sometimes feel like I'm too inexperienced to say "hey I want more sex" and that if I do say that it'll make him think I'm just naive or too sex focused. However, over the past three years I have brought up the subject at least three or four times now. And each time his response has been the same. He does take medication that can lower your sex drive, and I understand that, but there have been times where we've gone nearly three months with nothing. And I do understand that three months isn't really that long and that I probably shouldn't complain, but going that long really takes a toll on my mental health. Every time we've talked about it he always says that he's sorry and that he'll try to do better. And for a few months he'll make a small effort to try more, but then it dies down again. And to be fair it's not just on him for going a long time without sex. I don't come on to him as much as I probably should, but it's really hard for me to do that. It's hard for me to come on to him because I feel like if I did, I'd be forcing him to have sex with me or something. Which is probably really stupid to think, but I feel like that because of how little he shows interest. The longer it goes without him showing interest, the more I feel like I can't make a move. And I understand that issue has more to do with my own problems than him, but him showing no interest make those problems worse. Sometimes it gets to the point that whenever I want to have sex with him, it makes me feel gross and like I'm a bad person for wanting it and so I won't make a move. And this usually will cause me to fall into a depression and feel like I'm not good enough. This situation bothers me so much because my biggest love language is physical touch and intimacy. It's taken me multiple breakdowns over this to realize that I need sex and the connection that comes with it to feel loved. And I've told him before that I feel unloved sometimes and his response every time is "well why? I kiss you and hug you and tell you I love you every day and I do so much for you." Whenever he says that, it always leads to me feeling so gross and disgusting for wanting sex. I always think that "well he's doing everything he thinks he should so you have no reason to want more." This feels like an endless cycle at this point. This situation also really affects my self-confidence as well. He tells me I'm beautiful and that he loves my body all the time, but we have sex so little that I struggle to believe him when he says it. And once again I've told him this, and he just doesn't seem to understand why I would feel that way if he says stuff like that all the time. I don't know what else to do. At this point, I feel like I can't bring up this conversation with him again or he'll think I'm just complaining or something. I feel so stuck because I love him so much but I feel so distant from him and almost like he's more of a friend that I love rather than a significant other. Any advice is welcomed at this point. Should I try to bring it up again and possibly lead to an argument or should I just leave it and let him come to me for sex when he wants? TL;DR - Boyfriend doesn't show interest in sex anymore and it makes me feel unloved. Need advice on how to resolve the situation.” This one is genuinely hard.
KAYLA: That one is hard because she’s not someone that’s being like “oh you asshole.” She’s genuinely seems concerned about what he wants and making sure she’s not pressuring him.
SARAH: And she also seems to be very—she kind of understands herself and that she’s saying I’ve discovered I do need sex and the connection that comes with it to feel loved.
KAYLA: Which is not something that there’s nothing wrong with that. Sarah and I being people who don’t necessarily value sex as highly in relationships, that doesn’t make people who are like “I need sex to have relationships” I don’t think there’s anything wrong with that. Different people need different things. That’s tough if it’s two people who need different things. It almost seems like his love language is words of affirmation, telling her I love you, you look so great and he does all these things for her. Maybe he has a fundamental misunderstanding as someone who may not need physical touch to feel loved. He can’t really wrap his head around how someone would need that.
SARAH: Yeah at first I was like what do you mean not having sex for three months takes a toll on your mental health and when she explains why—she psychoanalyzed herself I was like, oh that’s super valid. If that’s your love language. I mean to be honest I feel like in this situation I’m like, I don’t know if this relationship is going to last because you just need different things.
KAYLA: Yeah especially if it’s something that is affecting her that deeply mentally and making her upset and making her feel guilty or she’s a bad person which I don’t think she is, I think she’s handling this very well, way better than most people handle this sort of thing. It’s hard when she says, I love him a lot, we get along really well, whatever but this is the one thing that is very difficult.
SARAH: She said this is the one thing that kind of feels platonic almost at this point, and someone in the comments was saying, “If it’s affecting you that much, you may need to just move on and find someone with a more compatible love language.” Someone else goes, “It's ok to need physical affection and sex in a relationship. There's nothing wrong with you needing this. But I doubt there's anything you can do to improve his sex drive - this is your first relationship. It won't be your last. It's good to learn that this is something you need in a relationship, you can find someone better matched I promise.” It’s hard to tell someone this, this person you clearly love and clearly have a connection to maybe you need to break up because you need different things but I don’t know she said it almost already feels like a friend than a significant other so maybe there is a relationship they can maintain even if they’re not dating.
(45:00)
KAYLA: But I do understand breaking up with someone by saying we don’t have sex enough, however valid that is, that is a tough way to break up with someone. If they get along great, if they love each other, if this is the one thing that sticks out as unresolved, that is tough.
SARAH: Someone in the replies said, “I saw that some people showed their low libido partners r/DeadBedrooms subreddit and it helped them understand how the higher libido partner felt. It’s ultimately up to him whether he wants to work on things.” I think you are going to have to be very clear that it’s not just we’re not having enough sex. It’s you know, yeah I don’t know.
KAYLA: It’s hard because I don’t think you know, it’s not just he’s going to increase his libido or how much he wants to have sex. He might be more cognizant of her wanting that. That’s not going to change how he intrinsically feels.
SARAH: Right.
KAYLA: So.
SARAH: It’s hard.
KAYLA: As she says, I don’t want to come on to him because he’ll think I’m pressuring him.
SARAH: She doesn’t want to have non-consensual sex, she wants to have consensual sex with him.
KAYLA: Right so I don’t know if it’d be a conversation of just so you know when I come on to you, it’s okay to say know. I don’t know it’s really tough.
SARAH: Alright, last one. This is titled, “Is love and sex just not as great as imagined, or am I just not with the right partners?” “I (23f) am starting to feel really disillusioned by love and sex. I know that love stories and porn aren't real or as glamorous. But I thought that I'd still feel a deep love and excitement in the relationship as I would at the thought of it. Like if you really want a burrito, and you get that burrito it's amazing. But thus far I've always wanted deep love and sex but now that I've got it, I feel kind of numb like "....this is it?..." This is what all those songs are about? This is what people turn their lives upside down and have lethal betrayals over? I don't know, I just get a sense of disappointment. And to be honest one of the things that was keeping me excited for the future and wanting to live life was finding a lover. But I can't tell if I just haven't been with good partners or my expectations were just insanely high and it'll never be great.”
KAYLA: I feel like the thing of having too high expectations, I understand that. Even I in a long-term relationship sometimes I’ll see couples on social media or videos about “blah blah blah this with my boyfriend” and I’m like, oh it seems like their relationship is way more lovey-dovey or way more whatever than mine. Is there something wrong with mine? I think that’s a pretty valid thing of having your expectations let down if you’re always watching romantic movies or reading books or whatever. It’s not really like that.
SARAH: Or if you think you see the PDA and whatever and you get into it and you’re like actually I’m not really comfortable with PDA. That’s not how your relationships are going to look. To me I look at this and I’m like, there’s definitely an aspec—this to me screams aspec. Everyone in the comments, this person’s like, “I saw an update to a question like this once. It was about a year later. Poster said, "Nevermind, I'm just gay," or something like that. Point being, if you aren't happy with the people you are with, maybe you are with the wrong people. Broaden your options.” And then someone was like, “You just haven’t found your person yet.” And that could be true but no one is mentioning the aspec.
KAYLA: It’s hard because it could be true they haven’t met the right person but also I do very much get aro vibes from saying they feel numb to it and this isn’t really like what. Yeah. It’s hard because her saying oh this is the thing people turn their lives around for, do whatever for, it’s hard when there’s such a societal expectation of this is everything and then you eventually find out it’s not. Whether you’re aspec or not that can be a pretty jarring thing.
SARAH: This person says, “You sound like a super romantic, but it also sounds like maybe how you conceptualize love and passion is really rooted in high drama? You want big feelings and to be overwhelmed with the power of it? That does happen, that’s just not always how it happens.” And then they went on to talk about things. Which is, that’s also a good point. Kind of going back to what you were originally saying.
KAYLA: Yeah it’s hard cause I feel like there could be a lot of things happening, being aspec included, and that’s something I wish someone commented because it’s a good thing to consider.
SARAH: Part of me is just like—
KAYLA: Should I comment?
(50:00)
SARAH: I don’t have an account! I don’t want to make one just for this.
KAYLA: I mean—
SARAH: Do you want to make one just for this?
KAYLA: I have an account somewhere but I like—
SARAH: Make a Sounds Fake Reddit account.
KAYLA: That sounds like a lot of work. Maybe y’all could find this and you all can comment.
SARAH: Yeah I think this reads as super aspec to me. It doesn’t necessarily have to be aspec but there is—
KAYLA: The vibes are strong.
SARAH: And I will bully Kayla into using her account to post about that.
KAYLA: I don’t know about that.
SARAH: Cool, that was it.
KAYLA: Fun!
SARAH: That’s all I’ve got. I was actually really surprised how easy it was to find stuff that could directly be connected to aspec issues.
KAYLA: Yeah.
SARAH: Cause I felt like a lot of them were about like that. A lot of the people had different understandings and expectations as to what sex and romance are supposed to be and that’s a super universal thing whether you are aspec or not.
KAYLA: Yeah I feel like people forget about that a lot. Of like, even though there’s this whole societal script of what sex and romance look like, people still have very different views on it and even in allo relationships that can be something that’s very difficult to navigate.
SARAH: Yeah, yeah.
KAYLA: Indeed.
SARAH: So that’s all we’ve got. Kayla, what’s our poll for this week?
KAYLA: Oh. Oh no.
SARAH: Do you trust Reddit to give you relationship advice?
KAYLA: Everyone’s going to say no.
SARAH: I mean there was some good advice.
KAYLA: I mean sure I think Reddit can give good advice. I feel like a lot of the comments sounded very good but I feel like my knee-jerk reaction to “does Reddit give good advice” would be absolutely not.
SARAH: Basically you’re asking strangers for advice. I don’t ever trust strangers to give me advice.
KAYLA: That’s fair.
SARAH: Why are the allos like this? Open-ended.
KAYAL: Ummm… maybe like the first one we did, the guy mad at how many people his fiance slept with, we can be like, who is actually in the wrong here? Is it the guy or is it the lady or is it no one or everyone?
SARAH: Yeah I feel like not a lot of people are going to say the lady but I mean she did lie about how many people she had sex with. Or at least misled him.
KAYLA: Yeah which is—lying isn’t great.
SARAH: Okay sure. Kayla, what’s your beef and your juice this week?
KAYLA: Um…
SARAH: I have a beef can I do my beef?
KAYLA: Sure.
SARAH: My beef is that I have one of those really deep zits that you can’t see but you can feel and you know where it is? It’s in my lip.
KAYLA: Ew that does not sound good.
SARAH: And it’s not right above my lip. It’s in my lip. Like when I put lip balm on it hurts.
KAYLA: That sounds incredibly painful.
SARAH: but it’s not advanced enough that I can do anything about it and that’s my beef. My juice is that I finished Loki last night on Disney Plus. People have thoughts, I’m kind of curious what people think my thoughts are going to be. But i don’t want to spoil thing.
KAYLA: I think your thoughts are probably that you don’t care.
SARAH: My thoughts are sort of along those lines. But we can go into this at a later time maybe when we’ve past the 2 week spoiler line, whatever. Whatever the thing was. Okay. Wait you haven’t—
KAYLA: I was just going to let you keep going. My beef is that demisexuality has been getting a lot of press recently, has not been done justice, no one seems to decide to consult an actual demisexual person but I’m like so exhausted by it I haven’t really commented on it on our socials or anything which makes me feel like a bad activist but it’s also like, not great for my health to keep reading these articles and talking about it so—
SARAH: You know what the most important thing in being a good activist is?
KAYLA: No.
SARAH: Taking care of yourself. You cannot be a good activist if you don’t take care of yourself and your own mental health. Sometimes that means not diving into some of the bullshit.
KAYLA: I know. For one, I know it’s good to talk about this kind of stuff but for two I’m like, everyone is focusing on aspec stuff right now what a great time for us to get clout and more listeners. So it’s just like, anyway.
SARAH: Fuck the clout.
KAYLA: I know but also we need it to stay live. Anyway.
SARAH: We have enough clout to stay live unless people suddenly started—unless we got canceled #SoundsFakeButOkayIsOverParty.
KAYLA: Don’t do that. Anyway that’s my beef. This whole thing. My juice is I got a new phone and I have Face ID now which means I can do the memoji which means I can send people the video of you doing an emoji when you text. So me and Sarah have been having a debate about some podcast business.
SARAH: We’ve been having a business conversation exclusively through Memoji videos.
KAYLA: Yes we’ve been having, yes.
SARAH: I was a dinosaur, I was a unicorn, you were an octopus, you were a cow.
KAYLA: I’m a big fan of the alien one because you can puff up your cheeks really big which I think is really funny.
SARAH: I tried the giraffe but it wasn’t very expressive.
KAYLA: The giraffe isn’t very great. Anyway that’s been fun and it’s the only way I will now talk to anyone is through memojis.
SARAH: Good. If you want to tell us about your beef, your juice, your favorite memoji you can find us on social media @soundsfakepod. Follow us so that we can have 6,0002 followers on Twitter. We also have a Patreon, patreon.com/soundsfakepod for those of you who want to support us financially if you’d be able to, we’d be very grateful. Our $5 patrons who are being promoted this week are Emily M., Elizabeth Wheeler, Ffinasfs, our fave, Melissa Kaufman, and Byron Rusnak. You’re all great. You’re all equally as great even if you don’t have as fun names to say as Ffinasfs. Our $10 patrons who are promoting things this week are Anonymous who would like to promote Halloween, my aunt Jeannie who would like to promote Christopher’s Haven and Cass who would like to promote the best of luck on the journey of self-identification. Our other $10 patrons are Doug Rice, H. Valdis, Purple Chickadee, Barefoot Backpacker, The Steve, Ari K, Mattie, Derek and Carissa, Aaron, Khadir, Potater, Changeling MX, David Jay, The Stubby Tech, Simona Sajmon, and Rosie Costello and we have two new $10 patrons, they are Hector Murillo who would like to promote friends that are supportive, constructive, and help you grow as a better person. For they will provide you with the tools to do the same with them and everyone you care for! What a great thing to promote but it also makes you grateful that we’re not doing everyone’s promotions cause that would take a long time for me to read every week but you’re right Hector. And also Jay who would like like to promote their podcast out_cast. Thank you both of you for joining the party, we’re very grateful. Our $15 patrons are Nathaniel White - NathanielJWhiteDesigns.com, my mom Julie who would like to promote free mom hugs, Sara Jones who is @eternalloli everywhere, Andy A who would like to promote being in unions and IWW, Martin Chiesel who would like to promote his podcast, Everyone’s Special and No One is, Leila, who would like to promote love is love also applying to aro people, Shrubbery who would like to promote the Planet Earth, Dia Chappell who would like to promote twitch.tv/MelodyDia, Sherronda J Brown, Maggie Capalbo who would like to promote their dogs Minnie, Leia, and Loki, Andrew Hillum would like to promote the Invisible Spectrum podcast, and Dragonfly who would like to promote suddenly feeling very warm.
KAYLA: I also feel very warm right now.
SARAH: Is it cause I’m going fast, I don’t know what it is. Actually I don’t think Dragonfly wants to promote that, they just want to bring visibility to it you know. Our $20 patrons are Sarah T who would like to promote long walks outside and HomHomofSpades who would like to promote getting enough Vitamin D and never telling me how to say their name so I keep saying HomHomofSpades. Thanks for listening, tune in next Sunday for more of us in your ears.
KAYLA: And until then, take good care of your cows.