Ep 174: Discovering Demisexuality feat. Chantel Houston

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SARAH: Hey what’s up hello. Welcome to Sounds Fake But Okay, a podcast where an aro-ace girl (I’m Sarah. That’s me.)

KAYLA:… and a demi-straight girl (that’s me, Kayla)

CHANTEL: And a queer, pan, demi girl, that’s me Chantel. 

SARAH: talk about all things to do with love, relationships, sexuality, and pretty much anything else that we just don’t understand.

KAYLA: On today’s episode, Chantel Houston.

ALL: — Sounds fake, but okay.

SARAH: Welcome back to the pod!

KAYLA: M’illennial.

SARAH: I had one prepared for this week too, I was going to say M’eghan M’arkle. 

KAYLA: Ah. Ouch. There was a lot of discussion on our Discord this morning of people trying to figure out how old we are. And then trying to decipher whether we are millennials or Gen Z which neither of us know either so.
SARAH: We’re zillennials is what we are.

KAYLA: We’re zillennials, yes.

SARAH: I also love the people in the Discord who were like, “oh they’re younger than I thought,” yes we’re children.

KAYLA: Yes, don’t take our advice!
SARAH: Anyway, what a great way to start this podcast with a guess. Kneecapping us from the start. Obviously, we have a guest this week. Chantel, thank you for being with us.

CHANTEL: Thank you for having me. We’ve been trying to do this for a while but my schedule’s just been super crazy so I appreciate you guys being so flexible with me. I’m so happy to be talking with you both.

KAYLA: You’ve been very busy, you were doing things from the Biden campaign and I was like, “oh shit, please don’t email us you’re busy doing real things.” 

CHANTEL: I was a senior producer on the Biden for President campaign.

KAYLA: That’s wild.

CHANTEL: It was exciting to be such a direct part of it. Especially since we won. My campaign record is one for one. 

SARAH: Yes!

KAYLA: Just stop there honestly, you did it.

CHANTEL: I probably will stop here. 

SARAH: Perfect record. For those of our listeners who don’t know who you are, me and Kayla were first introduced to you through Ladylike on Buzzfeed but you’ve been doing all sorts of other things. You do a lot of things. So can you just give a brief introduction to who you are and what you do?

CHANTEL: Yeah, so my name is Chantel Houston. I feel like I’m known on the internet world for the same exact way that you both know me which is through Ladylike on Buzzfeed. I worked at Buzzfeed for 5 and a half years. I only ever planned to be behind the scenes but then Ladylike happened and they put me in front of the camera cause they were like, “you can help lead this right and be on camera” and I was like I guess? So in the early Ladylike videos, on camera I’m like, “hi, this is contouring, okay,” because I’d never been on camera before so I was like, what the heck is this? Especially in an unscripted way cause I’d been on camera a little bit in a scripted way but unscripted is completely different. And I was like, “so it’s just my personality, what are you talking about?” But then since leaving Buzzfeed, I’ve been directing and producing freelance. I just directed something yesterday for Refinery29 and before that my last big project was as a senior producer on the Biden campaign like we were talking about.

SARAH: Fancy lady.
KAYLA: So fancy! The main reason we’re having you on here is because you’re also demisexual. I don’t know that we’ve ever had a demisexual guest, have we?

SARAH: Aside from you. 

KAYLA: Well, yes.

SARAH: We haven’t. We have not.

KAYLA: So yeah, I don’t remember when you posted your video, it must have been a couple years now when you came out as demi, and I was like, *gasp,* another one. 

CHANTEL: And yeah, and it’s interesting cause my coming out journey I feel like every time that I’ve come out, I didn’t know I was coming out. I just saw it being like, yeah here’s something that I talk about and people are like, “oh my god, happy coming out video” and I’m like, is that what this was? I thought it was obvious before. The demisexual part of course, people didn’t know until I said it. Oh sorry my cat is trying to get into a drawer right now. The demisexual part, there was no way people would know that unless you talk about it, so that part I’m like, yeah of course. But the queerness, I feel like I’ve been posting rainbows and stuff like that for years and years. And I felt like Lil Nas X when he came out and he was like, “oh I thought it was obvious.” That’s how I felt years before!

(5:00)

SARAH: As you were saying that I was like, sounds like Lil Nas. You just thought everyone knew.

KAYLA: Not that Sarah thought everyone knew but that’s similar to how Sarah came out. She just posted an ace flag on her Facebook picture and was like “that’s it everyone I’ve done it.” 

SARAH: Yeah that is the strange thing about being aspec. You do have to actually choose to come out. Me having this podcast I guess is me coming out all the time. But, here we are. Since we’re on the topic, let’s just skip to the question about your coming out experience as demi. Obviously, you said in the times you’ve come out, it never felt ahead of time like you were coming out. How has the experience of coming out as demi compared to your other coming out experiences since you were a known person on the internet, known for other things when you came out?

CHANTEL: Figuring out that I was demi, it was a very casual thing because I was at Buzzfeed and they had invited someone from the LGBT center to come and talk to us. And the woman was trans and she was just talking about different sexualities and how to maneuver that as an ally or as part of the queer community. And she was like, it’s such a spectrum, there are so many things that people haven’t started talking about yet and she just rattled off a list of different things and one of them was demisexuality. And she was like, a lot of people don’t realize that things are real or that they exist but they are real. As I was listening, I was like, “oh yeah I’ve never heard of demisexuality, let me learn about it.” And then I Googled it and I was like, yeah this is how I feel, this is me and so at that point I was already dating a girl and everything like that. The demi part just felt like a little add-on so I was like, oh alright—

KAYLA: Just pick that up.

CHANTEL: Yeah exactly, I was like, sure, whatever cause it felt like I had already expressed and come to terms with who I loved and then I didn’t realize that how I loved was different from other people. I truly didn’t even realize it. So when I was reading about demisexuality, I was like, oh yeah this is me, is that different? And I started talking to people about it and they were like, “yeah that’s not how we operate.” So I was like, yeah let’s go, throw demi into the mix.

KAYLA: I feel like that’s how a lot of demi and generally aspec people are. They assume everyone else just feels that way and it’s like, uh, oh, maybe I do need to—not that you need to put a word on anything but like, oh.

CHANTEL: Yeah there’s definitely clarity that comes with knowing a label that something exists. And then from there you can choose to label yourself or not label yourself however you want. But it definitely helps with the initial understanding. At least that’s been my experience because even when I label my sexuality, it kind of changes. Technically I’d be pan and demi and I just say queer and then if people say “gay,” I’m like, that’s also fine. It’s like at the heart of it, I’m like, yeah I’m not straight. So whatever that means is fine. 

(10:00)

KAYLA: That’s all that really matters is you’re not straight.

CHANTEL: Yeah I’ve dated all kinds of people and it’s been fine. 

SARAH: I think that’s a misconception around the queer community more broadly but also the aspec community because the aspec community has so many different terms, is this idea that oh, people are super married to their terms or this specific word and you have to use this specific word. For some people the terminology is very important to them but honestly we’re all kind of in the same boat here. We’re in the queer boat and wherever you are in that spectrum is chill and I don’t know anyone who’s ever been super angry if someone accidentally uses the wrong term. No, it’s fine. These are just terms we use to describe ourselves and help understand ourselves better.

CHANTEL: Yeah and for the asexual spectrum in particular, I assume most people aren’t well-versed on it. I didn’t know until I knew and I was part of it. So, I’m not really—same as you all, I don’t really get offended. Any time I say, technically I’m also demisexual, people every single time have been like, “oh what does that mean?” so then I tell them about it. But then there’s times when I get tired and don’t feel like talking about it and I’m just like, oh you know whatever it’s okay.

KAYLA: I do that all the time. Like with this podcast, people will be like, “oh what’s your podcast about?” and I’m like it’s about relationships and sexuality and dating cause I simply cannot come out to you at this time. I can’t be doing this with you.

CHANTEL: Yeah, exactly. Takes the energy, I already have to come out with being queer and pansexuality and everyone always assumes because of how I look they’re like, “oh yeah do you have a boyfriend?” and I’m like, no but I have a girlfriend though and they’re like “oh.” And even then there’s been so many people I’ll say that and they’ll be like, oh okay and then the next day they’ll be like, “so are you dating anyone?” and I’m like, yeah I have a girlfriend. They don’t understand. Cause different generations I think use girlfriend differently.

KAYLA: Yeah it’s like, “that’s your really good friend.”

SARAH: Like yeah, that’s my really good friend!

KAYLA: All those medieval portraits of women being naked and making out and old white people are like, “oh my god they’re such good friends, they get to lay together they must be so close,” yes they’re so close actually. 

CHANTEL: Yeah my girlfriend, we’re close and we also kiss so that’s kind of like the point of it.
SARAH: Close in a lot of ways, good sir. I mean you have touched on this a little bit but how does your demisexuality interact with the other parts of your queer identity and your experience?

CHANTEL: In my experience, it led me to have a late in life discovery that I was attracted to all genders because with my demisexuality I had very few crushes in general and didn’t have that sexual attraction that many people experience and so it wasn’t like when I was growing up being like, “yeah I like boys and I like girls but I’m going to deny the part of liking girls.” It was more so that there just happened to not be any girls that I felt that attraction for. And then once I was 24, is when I was like, oh here’s a girl—this is the first time this has ever happened.

SARAH: Surprise.

CHANTEL: Oh wow, I might not be straight. The demisexuality definitely made my overall coming out prolonged just because I wasn’t having those sexual attractions to anyone aside from cis guys when I was growing up. It just happened to be that way.

SARAH: When you first were like, “oh wait turns out I’m attracted to girls too,” I mean obviously you didn’t know at that point you were demi, was your reaction just like, oh okay cool? Or were you like, why haven’t I felt this before? Why now? Did you have that experience?

(15:00)

CHANTEL: I think I went into a frenzy. I called my two best friends at the time, one who is gay, one who is straight. And ironically my straight friend has had pretty much every friend in her inner circle come out to her at some point. Sometimes there are straight people the queers gravitate towards. And my best friend happens to be one of them. I called each of them separately and I was like, oh my god I had a random coffee meeting with this family friend and I have a crush on her, what the hell does this mean? And I was being like “did you ever expect this from me?”

KAYLA: “Did you know I was gay? Were you keeping it from me?”

CHANTEL: Literally I was like, is this surprising to you? This feels crazy to me. I was like, I have a crush on a girl but I don’t feel different. It’s just the stupid stuff where it’s like, even when it comes to different things, like once I have my driver’s license then I’ll feel so much more grown up or once I get my first big girl job I’ll feel so much more grown up. But the fact of the matter is you don’t, it just happens, it’s just life and you keep going day by day. I was expecting that to happen with this too. And I was like, I don’t feel any different. This just feels crazy, did you know. My gay friend was like, “you know I can’t say I would’ve expected this from you since I’ve known you for five years and you’ve been straight the whole time but whatever floats your boat, that’s cool.” And then my straight friend who had been the witness to many coming outs, was like, “you know this is just how it happens for some people especially people who like both genders or multiple genders, this seems to be how it goes.” Oh my god. I don’t remember what your initial question was because I astral projected myself back into that frenzy but yeah it was a frenzy.

KAYLA: I feel like aspec identities do that to a lot of people though. It kind of prolongs everything. I feel like looking back now, knowing you’re demisexual, like okay yeah, of course it took you forever to have a crush on a girl because it takes forever to have a crush on anyone sometimes. 

CHANTEL: Exactly!

KAYLA: And I feel like looking back I have such a better understanding of what was going on with past relationships and why I was acting a certain way. But then there’s people who are like I just assumed I was bi because I had the same attraction to multiple genders but in reality that was just no attraction to any gender. It was the same for every gender but the thing was that it was zero instead of a lot.

CHANTEL: Yeah wow that’s super interesting. In part, because knowledge of the asexual spectrum was pretty much the only people who know about the spectrum are people who are on it or who actively know someone who is on it and is out about it. So, the general population still basically knows oh are you gay or straight? And so there’s no room for nuance and it’s like, sexuality is this whole nuanced thing, you know?

KAYLA: I feel like there would be so many ace and demi people if everyone knew about it. I learned about asexuality because Sarah was my roommate in college and she came out as ace and then was educating me and I was like, oh shit I’m demi. I could have easily gone my whole life and just been like, well I have a really hard time dating and having sex with people. I could have easily kept going.

CHANTEL: Yeah I would go years in between relationships because it was like, oh there doesn’t happen to be anyone I happen to have that attraction towards. There was this one guy who we were like dating and I was like, I find him to be so cute, so handsome, I was like this guy is to this day one of the most conventionally hot people, and I was dating him and he was really nice and stuff and we were getting along but then I was like, I just don’t really, I was like, yeah we can make dinner together but I didn’t have a desire for anything past that. And he was like, alright, yeah I feel like yeah, maybe we can call it. I was like, if you’re good with that, I’m good with that. Even people I’m like, on paper they’re like really good match, really cute, I was attracted to his looks but it didn’t go deeper than that. It was more so the knowledge of I know you’re really good looking but that was kind of it. 

SARAH: As someone who’s aro and ace, I totally get the aesthetic attraction of it all. I can look at a person and be like “wow” I could stare at your face all day. 

KAYLA: Sarah looks at me and she’s like, wow, beautiful, gorgeous.

SARAH: Yeah that’s the only reason we’re friends is cause I was like, wow she cute.

KAYLA: I want to keep looking at her.

SARAH: But I think that so many people who don’t understand the aspec assume that finding someone visually pleasing or finding them visually attractive is the same as being attracted to them in a romantic or sexual way but it’s not always the same thing. 

CHANTEL: No it’s very different. I can list 100s of hot people but that doesn’t mean I have that attraction to them you know? And it’s like, that’s exactly what you’re saying. That’s what hard for people to separate out. I remember when I was talking to one of my friends about being demi and I was like, yeah this is how I experience attraction and she was like, oh that sounds like exactly how I experience attraction so now she’s like, hey everyone I’m demi.

KAYLA: That’s what Sarah did for me basically. Sarah knew I was demi far before I did because kind of what you mentioned is when you found out you were demi you were dating someone. When I found out, I was dating someone I was like, well if I’m dating them it doesn’t matter. And then I put off coming out and deciding I was demi for two years. I think it’s a similar thing of you tell people oh this is what being demi is and so many people are like, yuppp me too actually.

SARAH: I’ve seen a lot of TikToks recently of young people coming out to their parents being like “oh I’m bi,” and their parents are like, “yeah that’s normal” and they’re like, “hmm.” I’m thinking like maybe you’re queer too, mom.

KAYLA: I keep seeing these people’s moms like “yeah it’s normal, every woman is attracted to other women” and the kids are like, “um, do we need to discuss something.”

CHANTEL: Yeah I know a few people also like that where they’re like, “you know it’s just the human body’s response” and stuff and I’m like no it’s not unless you’re attracted to them.

KAYLA: I think it was yesterday or the day before, I saw a TikTok of this man and I think he was straight because there was nothing gay about his profile but also that’s just me stereotyping but I have no idea but I’m assuming he was straight. But he made this video and was like “does anyone else have a really hard time differentiating romantic and platonic attraction” and then there were thousands of comments and people being like, “yeah it’s so hard it’s ruining all my relationships” and I was like, “you are all ace as fuck and you just don’t know it.” Someone needs to tell thousands of you.

CHANTEL: That’s such a good point. I didn’t have something click in my head until you were saying that but as a young adult people have always been like, “oh you’re so flirty, you’re so flirty.” But I was like, I don’t feel like I’m flirty. I feel like I’m just, you know, I have friends.

KAYLA: Being nice, yeah. Sarah has had the same thing.  

SARAH: I have had the same issue where I have been accidentally flirting with someone.

KAYLA: People just love having crushes on Sarah, she is just so attractive. 

SARAH: I have been accidentally flirting with someone and not realizing it and you know, it’s a person I like, it’s a person I felt comfortable with and joke around with them and give them shit and they took that as flirting and I was like, wait a minute, this is not what I’m going—I just want to be your friend.

(25:00)

CHANTEL: Yes, that makes so much sense. In high school and stuff I would have guys be like, you’re leading me on, part of which is just toxic, but the other part of it was like, oh you know what, I actually might have been and just didn’t know it. Later on, queer people who I’m friends with and everything, they’re like, “yeah I thought you were kinda into me at the beginning of when we were first meeting each other” and I was like, “what are you talking about” like, nooo. “You’re amazing but I never thought of you that way” so truly this conversation is shedding light into my brain like, ohh that’s probably why. And I think that the general population wouldn’t think of people on the ace spectrum as being flirty.

KAYLA: I feel like it’s so common though.

CHANTEL: Because you just think of “you don’t like anyone so whatever” and it’s like, maybe we’re actually flirting maybe we just don’t know it.

KAYLA: Aspec people might be more flirty than other people because I feel like that’s such a common thing I’ve heard from aspec people and people in our Discord talking about “these people have crushes on me and I don’t know why and I don’t know what to do with them” or like, what even is flirting, how do I tell if I’m flirting?

SARAH: I didn’t realize this person was flirting with me.

KAYLA: If you have no concept of this kind of attraction, how are you supposed to know you’re flirting? I don’t know.

CHANTEL: Yeah, exactly, and it’d be like, I don’t have that attraction for this person and so, well yeah, we’re just chatting, we’re teasing, we’re hanging whatever but then it’s like, the assumption that you don’t know until you know, just because I don’t have that attraction it doesn’t mean other people don’t have that attraction, which part of that comes with knowledge even being demi it’s like, oh yeah, guess I experience it way differently than other people I just had no idea. 

SARAH: And the idea too that just because you may not view people—I don’t want to say an object of attraction—cause that’s objectifying but I’m going to, for the context, I’m going to say, because I don’t view other people as an object of my attraction, I don’t think of myself as an object of other people’s attraction until something happens and I’m like, why do you have a crush on me that seems not right. 

CHANTEL: Yes, that’s exactly it. 

KAYLA: Especially if you’re aro and ace, if you’re never thinking about the concept of dating or sex, and it’s like why would you assume someone likes you? If you are someone who likes other people, maybe you’d think more often like oh my god, I have a crush on this person, who has a crush on me blah blah blah. For Sarah, it’d be irrelevant. Who cares?

SARAH: I know I’m cute, I know I’m funny but I do not take that to the next step. 

CHANTEL: Yeah it’s not even an option in your brain. It’s not something your brain even considers so then you don’t do the extra step of, oh I wonder if they’re having attraction towards me because it’s not something that you would ever even think about in that way.

KAYLA: I have a question, can I ask a question?

SARAH: Please do.

KAYLA: Thank you. You mentioned when you figured out you were demi you were dating someone. Has realizing you’re demi first of all if you have dated since did that affect your dating life and if not did that impact your relationship?

CHANTEL: I mean I would say it brought a lot of clarity to my relationship because other people would be like “oh that person is so hot” and I’d be like, oh are you in love with them? Like no. To me it’s like—

KAYLA: Oh you want to have their children?

CHANTEL: To me that’s what it was like thinking about it. Like if you have that attraction it’s cause you’re also romantically interested in them which is the definition of demisexuality so yeah she’d be like oh my god whatever queer icon, Cate Blanchett, and I’d be like, okay.. And she was like “no, that’s how I think about it at all.” It definitely cleared a lot of things up on both sides cause she’d be like, “why are you thinking this way” and I was like “why are you feeling this way you’re dating me” and so it only really helped and it hasn’t affected too much of my day to day since I have been in a relationship the whole time but even if I wasn’t, for me the main part was just I didn’t really develop many crushes. So anytime I had a crush I’d be like alright I’m going to date that person and then I would. Because it would be so rare so if I was able to have that attraction, then they were. Cause I’m the toughest component in there. So that’s just what it was. Not always of course, there were a couple people that I wanted to date that didn’t work out but yeah. I feel like if I were to winding finding myself out of a relationship and dating again, it would go back to the same thing where it’s like, alright it’ll probably take me a while till I find someone I have that attraction to and then we’ll kinda go from there. 

SARAH: Yeah. What you were saying about the Cate Blanchett of it all. It really made me realize when people talk about hall passes that totally reframed what people talking about hall passes is to me because I was like, oh they just really want to fuck them. They wouldn’t leave you for them, maybe sometimes they might leave you for them but that says more about your relationship than the person that they find attractive but I was just like, ohh totally reframed that in my brain just now.

(30:00)

CHANTEL: Yeah whereas the concept of hall passes in my brain is well if I had one then it’d be because I wanted to be in a relationship with that person. How it can mean so many different things depending on where you are on the spectrum.

KAYLA: That makes me rethink what you were saying about—oh my god, sorry Sarah you’re going to have some leveling on this one—it makes me think about when you were saying when you had a crush on someone you were like time to full-on long term relationship them which is always how I’ve been. I’m an absolute serial monogamist. But a while back I found my diary or something that I kept a whole two weeks freshman year of college and I had a massive crush on the guy across the hall but he didn’t want to date me he just wanted to make out, whatever college boy shit. And I wrote in my diary, I was like, I really want to date him, am I ready for that? And when I read it now I’m like, what a silly thing to think as a freshman I was just going to hop into a long term relationship you’re so stupid for thinking that but now I’m like you weren’t stupid that’s just what—I couldn’t do it any other way. I wasn’t being ignorant about how relationships worked. That’s just what needed to happen for me.

CHANTEL: Yeah it’s just how you function in relationships.

KAYLA: Young me wasn’t that stupid, I mean I was but not that time.

SARAH: I’m still offended you made out on my futon.

KAYLA: You’re lucky I ever told you that. I could have kept that a secret for the rest of my life.

SARAH: Oh man. Just pivoting from there, when you did publicly come out as demi, I guess two questions here, what was the reaction from the people in your life when they found out you were demi and what was the reaction from the broader internet when you did come out?

CHANTEL: People in my life, they’re kind of just like yeah cool that makes sense because it’s honestly pretty easy to understand once you explain it. And it’s like, “oh sure, great” because most of the time how people experience attraction, it’s pretty nuanced for every single person. Because they’re like oh yeah. And sometimes I’ll have people say, “wait that’s me too.” And I’m like, welcome! But the broader internet, I mean, I still get DMs weekly from people I don’t know, like “oh I didn’t realize I was demi until you were talking about it,” or like, “it’s so cool to know someone who’s also demi or aspec.” Anytime I tweet about it, I get so many responses that are just encouraging and I think just thankful to have people talking about it because we really don’t. We’re making a lot of strides in regards to the conversation about sexuality in other ways and we still have a really really long way to go. But yeah, this one is just something that hasn’t been touched upon yet.

(35:00)

SARAH: People are so starved for aspec representation.

KAYLA: Oh yeah, when you came out I was like, oh my god a known person that I know on the internet, I was shook.

SARAH: I remember Kayla texted me like, “look.”

KAYLA: I was like, get a load of this. Cause we used to watch Ladylike in college together and everything like that because we were those people. But it’s not like you have your influencers within the aspec community though. Ace people know. But there’s very few people who are broadly known in the world outside of being aspec who are then also aspec. I was like, uh someone is talking about it. This is incredible. 

CHANTEL: Yeah, it literally came out of a Google search because someone was like, here’s something that literally sounds fake but it’s not so look it up. I was like alright I’ll look it up and thought, oh that’s me. But you kind of don’t even know what to look up until someone tells you. I’d taken interest in the asexual spectrum just because I am a queer person and just constantly trying to educate myself better, but I don’t think that I ever would have gravitated towards let me do a deep dive into what demisexuality is, until someone was like, here’s something that you all can look up and there’s that.

SARAH: For me I knew about the asexual spectrum years before I ever identified with it. I knew the basics and once I started questioning, and that was when I did the deep dive like what does this actually mean. 

KAYLA: It just proves why we need people talking about it. Like you said, if that person had never come to your place of work and been like, here are some sexualities, it never would have happened. And so many people just don’t have that, there’s not people that are just like, here have you thought about this one maybe?
CHANTEL: Yeah there aren’t people going around preaching the queer gospel of terms we should all know.

SARAH: And even within the queer community, there are so many people that don’t know about the aspec. That’s not their fault. But, you know, let’s make it so that more people do know.

CHANTEL: I feel like most people don’t know there is stuff to be learned because they think asexual can have whatever definition in their mind for that and kind of look no further. And for a long time that’s even how I was too I was like, okay yeah, I want to understand what it means to be asexual but pretty much on the two sides of the spectrum, sexual versus asexual. And that was kind of it. We like to think in binaries, we’ve been taught to think in binaries, so it’s easier to say oh I know what the left looks like, I know what the right looks like and that’s it. But there is a lot of freedom in the middle ground when it comes to queerness.

SARAH: And too with the split model of attraction with romantic and sexual attraction not necessarily being the same thing. That’s a very aspec notion in that it’s only really well known in the aspec communities. It obviously applies to everyone but even people who are knowledgable about broader queer spaces may say asexuality and they assume that also means aromantic but it’s a lot more complicated than that, buddy.

(40:00)

CHANTEL: Especially when I talk about “oh I’m on the asexual spectrum” and it’s like, “oh you’re in a long term relationship, so what do you mean?” Well I do experience romantic attraction and sexual attraction but with a couple caveats. And so I think people just kind of assume, okay maybe we are kind of like just roommates and that’s it. Like, no, there’s so much else, there’s so much room in the middle.

SARAH: Oh my god they were roommates. 

KAYLA: And they were roommates.

CHANTEL: All along. And it’s like, “well we thought they were dating.” No we are.

SARAH: Gal pals.

KAYLA: Just a couple gals being pals, nothing to see here.

SARAH: Or there’s the idea that when people say aspec or ace it doesn’t just refer to people who are on the far side, like I don’t experience any attraction. There’s just so much in between and obviously it can be difficult for people to understand, I get that, it can be very complicated for people to get their mind around, but it’s like, as long as we come into it with an open mind, it’s okay, let’s just learn as we go.

KAYLA: Everyone just chill out.

CHANTEL: As a whole we just need to accept that everything is a spectrum and it’ll be a lot simpler for all of us.

KAYLA: That’s true. I have the door closed so my cats can’t bother me and usually my cats would at the door screaming. The only explanation is that they’re dead because I don’t know why they’re not screaming at me.

CHANTEL: I was like, I can close my door but he’s going to be pawing at it that’s going to be a nightmare. He just has to roam free.

SARAH: He’s just another guest on the pod. One last question related to what we were saying. Do you feel comfortable talking about your demisexuality in broader queer spaces? Is that something that you are ever wary of or do you just dive in and say, “if you are going to be exclusionary, I don’t like you?”

CHANTEL: I mean in the broader queer sense, I would say I’ve spent most of my time and energy having to be accepted as a person in a same sex relationship. Like that’s just where I’ve personally had the most struggles with acceptance. So then I kind of have been forced to see my demisexual self as secondary, not secondary as who I am but secondary in terms of talking about it just because the other part can still be so hard to wrap their heads around. But then once people really know me and understand that part of myself, that’s when I generally open up about being demisexual. Or sometimes my girlfriend will just be like, “oh yeah Chantel is on the asexual spectrum” and I’m like, oh yeah let’s talk about it. I’m more so kind of like, look at it from an educational perspective versus a coming out perspective just because I’ve had so much more trouble in being accepted as queer so I feel like I kind the dust to settle on that part before I dive into the demisexual part, especially because of how I present. Everyone assumes I’m straight. I have to come out literally every day so it gets kind of exhausting. 

KAYLA: Yeah and it’s so much more visible. We talk about this. You can’t look at someone and go, oh yeah they’re ace. But you can see someone in a same sex relationship like holding hands, kissing, whatever and go, oh yeah they’re queer. You have to confront it so much more often because if you go out with your girlfriend, you can’t hide it really.

SARAH: Just call yourself gal pals, call it a day.

CHANTEL: I know there’s times when we’ve been, okay this person is sketchy, we’re roommates for an hour. 

SARAH: Yeah.

CHANTEL: But, you know.

SARAH: Hopefully we’ll be able to move past that as time goes by.

KAYLA: One day.

CHANTEL: Eventually I know that we will. Even with Gen Z. Gen Z thinks about sexuality so much more differently than millennials, than Gen X, than boomers, and so I’m really thankful for how open all the younger generations are because change just happens slowly and over time and with each generation we get more and more progressive. We’ll get there eventually. I was a young adult when same sex marriage was legalized. Even just coming from where things stood when I was born, to 29 years later, there’s been a lot of strides. It’s not enough yet, especially within the trans community. There's a lot more to go and I’m looking forward to seeing how things change and hopefully they can change as quickly as possible and I can help be a part of that change.

SARAH: I think young people today are so much better at embracing the fluidity of everything than even people like me and Kayla’s age who are barely older than Gen Z. I appreciate that things are going in that direction and hopefully someday, probably when I’m long dead, but maybe even sooner than that, we won’t have all of these expectations placed on people immediately and we can kind of, embrace the fluidity of it all. Wherever you fall is wherever you fall. That would be a nice world to live in. But there are a lot of things that would make the world nicer. 

KAYLA: What are you going to do?
SARAH: Just doing our best here. Kayla do you have anything to add before we wrap up?

KAYLA: I don’t think so. I am just excited—I don’t think I get to talk to other demi people all that often. I feel like most of the aspec people I know are just like, ace, so it’s been fun, thank you.
CHANTEL: Yeah thank you so much for having me. I feel the same. I feel like I’ve only had an open conversation with another demi person like once, if that. And so, it’s definitely fun to not be the outlier.

SARAH: I’m the outlier in this conversation. It’s delightful in a new and fun way. Great. Okay, Kayla what’s our poll for this week?

KAYLA: Oh god.

SARAH: We can ask, have you had these conversations? Have you literally ever talked to a demi person about demisexuality, whether or not demi?

KAYLA: Have you ever?

SARAH: Have you ever encountered a human person? Do we want to do that?

KAYLA: Sure.
SARAH: I see that you’re typing. So I will go onto my beef and my juice. My juice this week is resistance bands. I bought some.

KAYLA: You’re incredibly lame.

SARAH: They say they’re going to open up gyms. I’m not going in there. I need to work out more and I don’t want to spend a billion dollars on weights. So I was like, I’m doing it I’m buying em. And you know what? They’ve been great. 

KAYLA: Dean did that recently and he has this free weight and these resistance bands and they sit under the couch in my office. So ever so often, he’ll come upstairs, he’ll go pee, and then he’ll come into my office and do some curls and I’m like, I’m fully working and he’s in the background of my Zoom calls like ehhhhh. I’m like you’ve got to go away.

SARAH: My beef is that people were like, move to California they said, it’ll be fun. If I were in Michigan, I’d be able to get vaccinated next month. But no, I live in LA.

KAYLA: Move to California, they said.

SARAH: I can’t get the vaccine till 2030.

KAYLA: Come here! Down here, they’re tossing them at people.

CHANTEL: Where are you, Kayla?

KAYLA: I’m in Louisiana. Transitioning away from Sarah, this is my time now—

SARAH: I have more beef. I want to yell at Spectrum.

KAYLA: Okay but you’re missing out on a great segue.

SARAH: It’s one more line. I’m very mad at Spectrum because they’re like, we want you to pay $70 a month just for Internet and I’m like, excuse me? In this economy? Anyway that’s all you can go on.

KAYLA: Okay, segueing from Sarah not being able to get the vaccine. My juice is that in a couple hours, I’m getting my first round of vaccines.

SARAH: You are?

KAYLA: I am! Because down here in Louisiana, they opened it up to 16+ and all you have to have is the minorest of health conditions and they just throw it at you because all of the hicks down here don’t want them so they have to keep opening it up.

CHANTEL: Yeah, gotta go somewhere that people don’t want them, then there’s a lot of availability.

KAYLA: I know of someone who is flying—well maybe now they canceled it now that they could get it next month—but their plane was to fly from Michigan, down south, get one round of vaccines, fly back, wait 3 weeks, fly back and get one, which I think highly just goes against the point of getting vaccinated. Flying around spewing your germs.

CHANTEL: It absolutely the point of it.

KAYLA: And that’s just a lot of privilege, having the money to be able to scalp a vaccine. Anyway I’m getting my first round in a couple hours, I’m very excited. My beef is that it’s 80 degrees and humid down here and I’m not used to that cause I’m from Michigan and just moved here a couple months ago and I am upset about how much I’m sweating it’s awful.

CHANTEL: Can’t do humidity. My hair won’t allow it.

KAYLA: Look at this, look at my hair.

SARAH: This is an audio medium Kayla the listeners can’t see.

KAYLA: I’m talking to Chantel, not them. It’s awful. 

SARAH: That’s my beef. We started this call and Kayla was like, it’s 80 degrees and I was like in LA it’s 54. 

KAYLA: It’s awful. It’s horrendous. I can’t open my windows cause there’s no screens so my cats will just jump out the window.

CHANTEL: Oh no, yeah they probably will.

KAYLA: No they probably would, they’d leave and go play with the feral cats, all 50 of them that live in my neighborhood.

SARAH: Great, wonderful.

KAYLA: Do you have beeves and juices, Chantel?

SARAH: What is your beef and juice—they can be as big and small as you desire.

CHANTEL: My juice is that I had my first gig yesterday just being paid to explicitly direct, which is very exciting because that was my goal for this year. 

KAYLA: Oh my god so early.

KAYLA & SARAH: What are you going to do now?

KAYLA: You can just relax for the rest of the year. Just take the year off, you did it.

CHANTEL: Hopefully it’s the first of many but we’ll see. I’ve gotten a chance to direct a lot of different things but none of them have been explicitly been, oh yeah we are hiring you to direct this. So that was something that was really cool. Hope I did a good job and hopefully they’ll keep calling me back. 

SARAH: Hell yeah.

CHANTEL: What is my beef? There’s just like, so many. 

SARAH: I’ve been known to have my beef just be like, capitalism. Sometimes I’m like, I can’t even get to a specific, I’ll be so angry if I start talking about something.

KAYLA: Sometimes Sarah will sit on her phone and write notes on how angry she is and then she’ll get onto the show and be like, I can’t do a full rant today.

SARAH: I have to delete this, I can’t do it, I’ll get so riled up.

CHANTEL: My beef is, so I’m a LA native and my beef is that anytime it rains it floods everywhere. And it just rained for two days and it didn’t rain super hard this time, although some people had hail. So my beef is, I’m just like, one more drain and that would help. We’re just accepting that anytime it rains it floods everywhere?

KAYLA: I feel like LA almost does it on purpose. They’re like we could but we want to give everyone the day off. You don’t have to drive anywhere cause it’s flooded. I feel like they did it on purpose. All the government workers that could put in a drain are like, I don’t want to go to work, I’m going to let it flood.
CHANTEL: That’s my main beef since I was driving in it yesterday so I was like, come on, tier them off. We know how to do that, that’s standard. Make a little tier, let it run off, that’s all we gotta do. That’s my semi inconsequential beef.

SARAH: Sometimes those are the best ones. I feel like it’s so rare to meet a native Angelino. I’m like wow you’re like a unicorn, this is exciting.

CHANTEL: I know it’s interesting especially cause in entertainment, most people have moved here. So they’ll be like, where are you from, and I was like here, and they’re like what do you mean?

SARAH: I’m of course the import for the entertainment business and people are like where are you from and I’m like I’d die for the state of Michigan.

KAYLA: Sarah’s like, I don’t want to be here at all I’d like to leave but I can’t. Wearing a hat that says “the midwest.”

CHANTEL: It’s a good hat.

SARAH: Thank you. My sister got it made especially for me because I was moving to California. 

CHANTEL: Wow. Very specific.

SARAH: She was like I have the gift for you.

KAYLA: This hat has everything.

SARAH: Wonderful. You can tell us your beef, your juice, answer whatever our poll was, I already forgot, tell us how much you love Chantel on our social media @soundsfakepod. We also have a Patreon—patreon.com/soundsfakepod. I will put the patrons later, everyone say hi to Sarah from the future. Hi it’s Sarah from literally 5 minutes into the future. Our $2 patrons, we have a new one, it’s Kat Foisy, thank you Kat for joining the party and I think you have a fun name. Our $5 patrons are Jennifer Smart, Asritha Vinnakota, Austin Le, Perry Fiero, Dee, Quinn Pollock, Emily Collins, Bookmarvel, Simona Sajmon, Jamie Jack, Jessica Shea, Ria Faustino, Daniel Walker, Livvy, Madeline Askew, Lily, James, Corinne, AliceIsInSpace, Skye Simpson, Brooke Siegel, Ashley W, Savannah Cozart, Harry Haston-Dougan, SOUP, SOUP I’m sorry that you realized I’m a child, Amanda Kyker, Vishakh, Jacob Weber, Rory, Amberle Istar, Rachel, Kate Costello, John, Ariel Laxo, Ellie, Tessa, MattiousT, Chris Lauretano, Sam, Kelly, Scott Ainsli, Orla Nieve Eisley, Julianne, Lost In Space, and Colleen Walsh. Thank you for joining the party, Colleen. Our $10 patrons, are Arcnes who would like to promote the Trevor Project, Benjamin Ybarra who would like to promote me playing D&D second episode is out now on our Patreon, anonymous who would like to promote Halloween, Sarah McCoy who would like to promote Podcast From Planet Weird, my Aunt Jeannie who would like to promote Christopher’s Haven, Cassandra who would like to promote manifesting positivity, Doug Rice who would like to promote "Native" by Kaitlin Curtice, H. Valdis, Purple Chickadee, who would like to promote—oh a bunch of people told me they wanted to change their patronages and I didn’t write em down did I? Didn’t write em down. Well you are live—I’m checking the Discord. Purple Chickadee would like to promote using they as a gender neutral singular pronoun, wow that was really good timing that I remembered that Purple Chickadee wanted to change theirs. Barefoot Backpacker, who also has a new promotion in the Patreon. Barefoot Backpacker would like to promote Mother’s Day on the ground that Sunday, March 14th is Mother’s Day which is just incorrect for those of us who are American, I understand that the Europeans experience the world in a different manner. So, Barefoot Backpacker would like to promote Mother’s Day, The Steve who would like to promote Ecosia, Ari K. who would like to promote The Eyeball Zone, Mattie who would like to promote The Union Series by T.H. Hernandez, Derek and Carissa who would like to promote the overthrow of heteronormativity in support of Melody the hamster, Andrew Hillum would like to promote their cat Sarah Jane. Aaron like to promote free forehead kisses, Khadir who would like to promote Gnocchi Feta Fettuccine as a wonderful name for any cat, Potater who would like to promote potatoes, ChangelingMX who would like to promote their home on the Internet, starshipchangeling.net, and Sarah Kujawa who would like to promote her dogs’ Aviat and Stevie’s Instagram @aviatthehusky. Our $15 patrons are Nathaniel White - NathanielJWhiteDesigns.com, my mom Julie who would like to promote Free Mom Hugs, Sara Jones who is @eternalloli everywhere, Andy A who would like to promote being in unions and IWW, Martin Chiesel who would like to promote his podcast, Everyone’s Special and No One is, Leila, who would like to promote love is love also applying to aro people, Shrubbery who would like to promote the Planet Earth, Dia Chappell who would like to promote twitch.tv/MelodyDia, Sherronda J Brown, Maggie Capalbo who is promoting their dogs Leia & Minnie, and Dragonfly who this week would like to promote hydrating. Drink some water guys. Before we go, Chantel, where can the people of the internet find you?

CHANTEL: They can find me mainly on my Twitter and Instagram handles which is just @ChantelHouston. And then I have a YouTube page that I had to take a little break from but TBD on its resurrection but there are different queer videos on there should they want to see. Also youtube.com/chantelhouston. And me and the gals from Ladylike have a live show every Friday at 5, or is it 5.30 no I think it’s 5. You can look us up on YouTube for now we’re called the Untitled Lady Show but we do have a name that we’re thinking of. But if you Google Untitled Lady Show on YouTube you’ll find us.

KAYLA: I’ve loved following—I keep watching the Kitchen & Jorn Show, I love following all of the now since—

SARAH: Various ladies.

KAYLA: Various ladies who are moving on.

CHANTEL: Yeah one of the biggest questions is, do you still talk to each other, are you still friends, I’m like yeah.

KAYLA: No I hate them now! We all broke up.

CHANTEL: We’re all actual friends. People just kind of—with women, people assume, oh you all hated each other and it was catty and no, we’re just friends and our group chat is one of my most active group chats. We’re nice and nice to each other. 

KAYLA: We’re just good people is all.

SARAH: We’re not assholes.

KAYLA: Have you met Devon as well Sarah? Now you’ve met two ladies. Checking em off. Making the way through the ladies.

SARAH: That makes me sound like a stalker, like a predator.

KAYLA: Maybe you are.

SARAH: I’m not.

CHANTEL: You’re good, we get it. Happy to be one of two. 

SARAH: On that note, Thank you for listening, thank you for joining us Chantel, I hope we didn’t creep you out too much. Tune in next Sunday for more of us in your ears. 

KAYLA: Until then, take good care of your cows.